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Post by kibbins on Oct 12, 2020 4:36:23 GMT
Ok... I’m still processing this and need to vent. I don’t really know how to feel about this.
Long story short, SUPER push pull dynamic with DA/FA ex (he seemed to be triggered anxious possibly twice in 2.5 yrs). Main issues came down to him excluding me from his friend group, the relationship not progressing whatsoever, and complete sexual shutdown a year in to where he would actually exhibit a fear /run response if I tried to touch him, sometimes even just hug-wise.
Relationship sort of ended in a grey area when I forced an emotional convo about him being emotionally checked out.. he freaked out and left. Told me he was scared repeatedly, confused, that it felt emotionally unsafe for him to be around me.
Two weeks later he leaves on a month long trip with a group of friends that he basically kept revealing more and more details while on the trip about what it was exactly/who was on it. He was with a guy and two girls. He had gone to college w two of them. The third was a recent addition to their group, and his very good friend’s recent ex. He is very loyal to guy friends and very vocal about never being the type to move in on a friends ex. But this girl is very well liked by his friend group and right in the center of it, very easy for him to date her and he doesn’t have to worry about stashing someone and she’s already built in.. there was nothing going on technically between them prior to this trip. I don’t really think his friend group approved of me as he was very paranoid of them disliking me and in turn would exhibit throw me under the bus behavior. I do just wonder if this has longevity. I wonder about his sex issue. He sexually deactivated with all exes prior to me as well. He was told he had “Madonna whore syndrome”. I feel so stupid, as this was slightly under my nose the whole time, he always spoke highly of her but I never suspected he might have feelings like that. She isn’t the most attractive and doesn’t strike me as particularly smart or interesting, when he’s so picky about those things, it just seems so easy though since his friends are his LIFE... idk, I’m pretty shocked by all of this and can’t help but wonder what’s wrong with me as he has been vacationing with her for the past 3 months and we never even went anywhere, he even spent 2 months with her in a vacation house and he freaked out when we would spend even 2 nights together. Said he couldn’t sleep. Said he was scared at my apt. I’m a very laid back person. Why did this happen? Why is it so easy for him... with her? By the way, she requested to follow me last night on Instagram after posting a pic of them together and I texted him and asked why.. I had no clue they were dating. That’s when he admitted it. I had asked him before and he talked down on her and said no way, prior. I wished him well. He is 35. By the way, how weird is it that she requested to follow me, i met her like once before. Clearly wanted to try to flaunt their relationship to me? Very weird.. and she is watching all my stories. When i asked him why she followed me he casually was like, “Hello! Oh she was just asking abt you.”
Anyway, sorry, still reeling, and confused. I feel sick.
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Post by Helsbells on Oct 12, 2020 14:13:18 GMT
Ok... I’m still processing this and need to vent. I don’t really know how to feel about this. Long story short, SUPER push pull dynamic with DA/FA ex (he seemed to be triggered anxious possibly twice in 2.5 yrs). Main issues came down to him excluding me from his friend group, the relationship not progressing whatsoever, and complete sexual shutdown a year in to where he would actually exhibit a fear /run response if I tried to touch him, sometimes even just hug-wise. Relationship sort of ended in a grey area when I forced an emotional convo about him being emotionally checked out.. he freaked out and left. Told me he was scared repeatedly, confused, that it felt emotionally unsafe for him to be around me. Two weeks later he leaves on a month long trip with a group of friends that he basically kept revealing more and more details while on the trip about what it was exactly/who was on it. He was with a guy and two girls. He had gone to college w two of them. The third was a recent addition to their group, and his very good friend’s recent ex. He is very loyal to guy friends and very vocal about never being the type to move in on a friends ex. But this girl is very well liked by his friend group and right in the center of it, very easy for him to date her and he doesn’t have to worry about stashing someone and she’s already built in.. there was nothing going on technically between them prior to this trip. I don’t really think his friend group approved of me as he was very paranoid of them disliking me and in turn would exhibit throw me under the bus behavior. I do just wonder if this has longevity. I wonder about his sex issue. He sexually deactivated with all exes prior to me as well. He was told he had “Madonna whore syndrome”. I feel so stupid, as this was slightly under my nose the whole time, he always spoke highly of her but I never suspected he might have feelings like that. She isn’t the most attractive and doesn’t strike me as particularly smart or interesting, when he’s so picky about those things, it just seems so easy though since his friends are his LIFE... idk, I’m pretty shocked by all of this and can’t help but wonder what’s wrong with me as he has been vacationing with her for the past 3 months and we never even went anywhere, he even spent 2 months with her in a vacation house and he freaked out when we would spend even 2 nights together. Said he couldn’t sleep. Said he was scared at my apt. I’m a very laid back person. Why did this happen? Why is it so easy for him... with her? By the way, she requested to follow me last night on Instagram after posting a pic of them together and I texted him and asked why.. I had no clue they were dating. That’s when he admitted it. I had asked him before and he talked down on her and said no way, prior. I wished him well. He is 35. By the way, how weird is it that she requested to follow me, i met her like once before. Clearly wanted to try to flaunt their relationship to me? Very weird.. and she is watching all my stories. When i asked him why she followed me he casually was like, “Hello! Oh she was just asking abt you.” Anyway, sorry, still reeling, and confused. I feel sick. your story is almost identical to mine. Mine had a camper van that we literally went away in 3 times in all the 2.5yrs we were together. The most he could manage was 2 nights away as he found the space to small for 2 people. Within a month of me ending the relationship he meets a new women who is travelling Europe and ended up in lockdown in the uk. They have since been travelling Europe together for the last 5 mths in his camper van and hes even posted 1 photograph of them together which is an absolute first as he never post photos of the females he with on social media She is Canadian and he is from the uk so it would end up a long distance relationship but the fact that he can share such a small space for so long with a women who was almost a stranger when the set of has had me scratching my head no end. He would appear to have Madonna whore issues too as he told me he would never love a woman more than his mother. I never met her, she only lived 15 minutes away from my home, but his brothers wife has nothing to do with her and wont even allow her to see her grand children so god only knows what shes really like. He dotes on her. He to withdraw from having a sexual relationship with me and ended up buying pajamas to wear in bed and made it clear that any sexual relationship was of the cards. He watched porn alot behind my back and flirted on social media with other women. I am so glad to be shut of him as the relationship was seriously making me so ill and insecure that I became a complete different person. It's so uncanny how many stories on this site say the same thing hey. Like I said your experience is almost identical to mine. |
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Post by serenity on Oct 12, 2020 19:39:56 GMT
Hugs, its so awful how these relationships work out  Or should I say "don't work out". They are so gruelling and confusing when you're in them, and to see yourself replaced is the worst kind of heart break. You must remember, its nothing to do with you. Their issues started well before you met and will stay with them until they stop running from themselves. FA men I've loved seemed to express guilt in strange ways. They seemed to know when they were being excessively hurtful, but instead of making amends with the person they shafted, they'd focus their attention on being helpful or caring towards someone new. Might be helping new friends, or finding a new partner and inventing a narrative about their behaviour the new person cannot question. It always catches up with them. At best, they will find someone dismissive to keep them hooked in an anxious state, and they will be discarded by them. |
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Post by kibbins on Oct 12, 2020 21:31:04 GMT
Yes, it’s awful. Even though I knew it was hopeless and posted multiple times that it was over on here. I think the one thing I am left wondering here and can’t stop thinking about - he met me and his other ex off apps, although he did have one college girlfriend. But the point is he is very secure in his friendships and I wonder if the fact that this girl has been a friend... for almost a decade now, would make it so their relationship works out.. or would he get triggered more, since technically she may be closer faster? I know time will tell, but I’m having trouble understanding how a DA/FA who starts dating a longtime friend they’ve had a secure friendship with...tends to play out.
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Post by annieb on Oct 13, 2020 13:23:18 GMT
Avoidants in my experience date friends and exes and go back to exes and have phantom exes. Whether they ever have healthy relationships with them is a question. I think not. They can get triggered and turn anxious (this is disputed on these boards so this is only my opinion - I put all insecure attachment in one box), but they do not have secure attachment unless they have done a lot of therapy and not 6 months. More like three years.
Again, I’m so sorry about all this; and I went back to your previous thread. My advice then was to say your peace and block, Now my advice is to block all of them including the desperate new girlfriend.
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Post by annieb on Oct 13, 2020 13:44:06 GMT
Also if you ever wondered what your relationship looked like on the outside, then this is it. It may have even looked like a perfectly good relationship. Again this is my hard undifferentiated view (as Dr. Honda would call it, it is worth watching some of the Psychology in Seattle reaction videos to get some faith in humanity back), but it’s very fitting that they would be in a “blissful’ relationship doing all the things he couldn’t do with you. Again because of his own issues, he projected onto you, he is now projecting the opposite in the other person.
If you really step back from this and watch his behavior, it can appear quite erratic.
I don’t know if I’m explaining this all correctly, but his lack of health is simply transferred to a slightly different dynamic unless he did years of reflection and growth, which for the most part avoidants fiercely protest.
We have a lot of members write here and say that the person is happily in a new relationship, but I actually have an ex from five years ago that I’m still working with, and he is in a new relationship And I felt a tinge or jealousy until I actually asked him about it and it’s clear he is stringing this woman along without any intention to be in a real relationship with her. He is incapable of it. And therapy is not an option for him as he feels it would be like admitting a failure. He can’t do that, he has to uphold his construct of himself. This is how aware some of the avoidants are.
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 14, 2020 3:41:47 GMT
I want to second AnnieB ‘s suggestion to block him...or at least unfriend him.....when B made his new girlfriend FB official, I defriended him....not because of anything spiteful but because I knew I would get caught up in the comparison trap (which in truth, I did...here...for many months). B is now married to that girl and I haven’t gone to his FB page at all. I had to seriously ask myself what was the point of keeping tabs on someone who ultimately did not choose me....because I was only hurting myself with all the misreading and questioning and it was making me feel worse and not better...so that had to go. Honestly, I feel sooooooooooo much better about myself and my future now that I have zero contact.
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Post by amber on Oct 14, 2020 10:52:02 GMT
Also if you ever wondered what your relationship looked like on the outside, then this is it. It may have even looked like a perfectly good relationship. Again this is my hard undifferentiated view (as Dr. Honda would call it, it is worth watching some of the Psychology in Seattle reaction videos to get some faith in humanity back), but it’s very fitting that they would be in a “blissful’ relationship doing all the things he couldn’t do with you. Again because of his own issues, he projected onto you, he is now projecting the opposite in the other person. If you really step back from this and watch his behavior, it can appear quite erratic. I don’t know if I’m explaining this all correctly, but his lack of health is simply transferred to a slightly different dynamic unless he did years of reflection and growth, which for the most part avoidants fiercely protest. We have a lot of members write here and say that the person is happily in a new relationship, but I actually have an ex from five years ago that I’m still working with, and he is in a new relationship And I felt a tinge or jealousy until I actually asked him about it and it’s clear he is stringing this woman along without any intention to be in a real relationship with her. He is incapable of it. And therapy is not an option for him as he feels it would be like admitting a failure. He can’t do that, he has to uphold his construct of himself. This is how aware some of the avoidants are. I have been watching some of psychology in Seattle thanks to your suggestion! It’s awesome! Getting so much relationships insight. Really love this show |
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 14, 2020 14:38:26 GMT
I was giving this a bit more thought last night. It makes complete sense that I would be hyper aware of changes, experiences with the next girl as I did that with my brothers growing up....looking at ways they were getting treated differently then me and assuming it was because they were somehow better then me. It is a self protective, self defensive learned habit. The thing is, it is a flawed defense mechanism......it assumes different means better, it assumes different means something good about her and thus something inadequate in me, it also assumes different means he has changed, grown, become secure.....when none of that is necessarily true. I think the best path forward is not to try to figure “him” out or even “her” out....it is to ask....why do I need to interpret these events with zero information outside of things posted on FB and the rumor mill. Why do I feel the need to give such power to things being different.
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Post by kibbins on Oct 14, 2020 21:24:01 GMT
kind of weird turn of events here.. ex hits me up this morning telling me he is listening to some podcast and asking if he can send me money for painkillers that he could do either alone or WITH ME AT MY APT. (We took muscle relaxers once on a holiday and I have a friend who he knows sells them). He also specifies he would prefer to put the cash in my mailbox so there is no trail (for his new gf to see). Yikes on so many levels. I didn’t respond.
I think reality is starting to really hit him now.
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Post by alexandra on Oct 14, 2020 22:37:30 GMT
kibbins, something sounds more challenging here than simply an attachment style issue! This is bizarre on a lot of levels AND shows the relationship isn't great if he's taking so much care to hide something from the new woman AND it's substance abuse related to top it off. Please block both of them for your own sake. I'm sorry this is happening, but this guy is lighting up all MY red flags, and I have zero attachment to your situation!
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 15, 2020 4:30:36 GMT
kind of weird turn of events here.. ex hits me up this morning telling me he is listening to some podcast and asking if he can send me money for painkillers that he could do either alone or WITH ME AT MY APT. (We took muscle relaxers once on a holiday and I have a friend who he knows sells them). He also specifies he would prefer to put the cash in my mailbox so there is no trail (for his new gf to see). Yikes on so many levels. I didn’t respond. I think reality is starting to really hit him now. That is super creepy and very selfish on his part. |
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Post by annieb on Oct 15, 2020 14:04:46 GMT
That is a bizarre development, lacking any common sense and ignoring boundaries. Quite erratic on his part and fitting with all the other behaviors.. Remove these people from your future:) You have bigger and better coming. That’s one thing I know for sure that everyone on these boards, who sought help and reflected on their own behavior, got better.
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Post by kibbins on Oct 15, 2020 18:17:11 GMT
Agreed with all 3 of you. Major red flags, and this person has exhibited really abnormal behavior before. I noticed the girl unfollowed me and my account is private anyway. I blocked him and removed him off my Venmo. I was really feeling insecure and sad that it seemed like he was in a healthy relationship now since he literally spent 2 months with this new person and him and he could barely spend 2 nights in a row together. He also made an Instagram (didn’t have one before) and posted a pic of them 2.. he had told me in our relationship he had never posted a photo of himself and GF. He wouldn’t even tell his friends he was dating (me).
I suspect what happened was his avoidant tendencies weren’t coming up yet since she was just a friend, at first, and then they hooked up one night or something. He started thinking wow finally this will be a healthy relationship for me/easy since she’s in friend group already and also was still surrounded by friends in their vacation house so wasn’t very triggered yet. They come back and start spending more 1 on 1 time and he starts feeling triggered. Reality is starting to hit him. He is also realizing he is going to have to have “the convo” with the male friend of his about moving in on his ex. He contacts me about getting pain pills to escape bad feelings. I block.
Also pretty sure he is a covert narc or maybe some kind of sociopath. Anyway... I’m talking to someone new but honestly don’t feel ready so just going to continue on my own path for a bit. I’m still thinking about all of this way too much and blaming myself for trying to work out something dysfunctional for so long. Anyway.
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Post by serenity on Oct 15, 2020 19:27:56 GMT
Hugs Kibbins. The way he came at you like that is so rough. You did the right thing, and a brave thing, blocking him. If it ever makes you feel sad, just remember the space is essential for you to heal and get stronger. And it truly is the fastest and best way.
I feel he successfully managed down your expectations over the time you were with him, and he's still dangerous to you right now. He hasn't got there yet with the new girl, her expectations will still be high and "healthy" but it seems he's using triangulation with you to beat her down. Maybe its working, since she started contacting you on social media. Whatever's going on with them, its their hell to live through and its best you are not involved. He's not a "prize" to be won, he's emotionally and mentally unhealthy and cannot have healthy relationships without a lot of introspection. Let him face consequences for his terrible behaviour, including losing you.
In the short term , Work on raising your expectations again, and thinking about forgotten boundaries. You need those things to be in top form to face dating new people.
Sending you love.
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Or should I say "don't work out". They are so gruelling and confusing when you're in them, and to see yourself replaced is the worst kind of heart break. You must remember, its nothing to do with you. Their issues started well before you met and will stay with them until they stop running from themselves. 
