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Post by dullboat123 on Nov 9, 2020 4:30:23 GMT
Hi all,
Hope everyone is keeping safe in this pandemic. I am going through a very painful break up as I think I was love addicted due to me being AP.
As the subject title suggests, I (AP with DA/ was secure in 10 years of previous marriage) have been dumped by a DA female (some signs but not all) in June 2020 after 1.5 years. It was over for the fact that I let my insecurities get in the way by constantly clawing for the DA ex's reassurance which she is unwilling to give. Hence my "incessant questions" for reassurance made her always feeling on edge and nervous. She broke it off after I accuse her of cheating - due to some of her behaviours which are questionable and the lack of reassurance. Her leaving, without her saying, is all my fault. Its none of hers as she did not indicate she is at any fault. Her only real relationship was the one before me for close to 5 years. As I understood, her ex boyfriend spends most time gaming or hanging out with his friend/housemate in the living room while she lies on the bed surfing the net or watching movies. She was pretty much neglected. Which worked for so long because for DA, one of the main traits is "We are good but as long as we are not in the same room".
Though I am consciously and actively seeking therapy and showing huge improvements, every little missteps will make her pull away, blocking me for a month and coming back. She had blocked me twice and both came back after approx a month. The break up caused my anxiety to spiral out of control as I displayed a lot of protest behaviours - going to her house and even once jumped into the back of her car to try to "talk" her into getting back. Those actions did irreparable damage. This time round, she broke it off with me for good as she strung me along while finding someone new. All my efforts to try to work things out are met with "I don't know. I have no plans. I don't want to think about it. I don't want to talk about it.".
During courtship, she came on VERY strong. Almost like I am the prey whereby very early on, she said I am the ONLY one she wants to talk to, no one else. I would say it is the DA's way of love bombing to suck me in. Sex and physical contact like holding hands and cuddling are never an issue, though there are a lot of boundaries. However I did proved to her I am special and we met each other's parents and planned to get married and have a child. However it is all talk so it's easy. The break up happened RIGHT before we were to make a big decision to move in together. I was about to propose to her and had already bought her wedding dress.
Below is a list of her behaviours which made me think she is a medium DA:
1. Fiercely independent. She would rather struggle and withdraw from me than ask for a hand from me, her partner.
2. Lack of empathy for anyone. However she showed extreme empathy for animals.
3. Not much friends. She has only 2 close, childhood friends. Not a lot of acquaintances. The rest are pushed away/blocked. Even her own biological mother and sister are blocked with no chance of reconciliation.
4. Low energy. Daily life and simple tasks drain her. She works in retail and by the time she comes home everyday, she is drained. Thus most evenings are spent lying on the couch with her almost addicted to surfing Instagram. Not much deep conversations.
5. Conflicts are never resolved with her always going "I don't want to talk about it" or stonewalling.
6. Trouble committing to me or saying "I love you" - we went into a relationship 5 months after dating. To her, it is a record as her previous relationship of 5 years, they only became exclusive after 1.5 years. She said she struggles with saying "I love you" though once she started saying it to me, its frequent.
7. Requires a room of solitude where once she is shut in the room, no disturbances allowed.
8. Addictive personality (she is aware of that) - addicted to energy drinks and sugar in order for her to "cope". Most time spent scrolling Instagram and online. Prone to go down rabbit holes on the internet.
9. Likes to compartmentalise her life. Even me following her friends on Instagram would trigger an extremely angry response. Introducing me to her family and friends are seen as a monumental event.
10. Had tremendously traumatic childhood but often cannot remember much details when asked. Her past seems to be foggy with little titbits of information given to me to try to piece together her childhood. Often shuts down when probed a little.
11. Interaction with her is very surface. There are no deep conversations. She does not ever ask about my family and friends. Seldom ask about my kids.
12. Had depression and attempted but failed many times in taking her own life prior to meeting me.
13. Have next to no patience for anything or anyone.
These are just some of the behaviours that made me think she might be a DA. However I love her and adore her as we clicked mentally with very similar interests. Now that the relationship is over, I guess I wanted some assurance from you readers whether I dodged a bullet. She has a new target at the moment, even though it is long distance, I am sure she love bombed him into showing interest. The guy is a social butterfly with many options so falling for someone like my ex over long distance can only seem that he has been love bombed. As much as I want her to be happy, I do not think her new relationship will last as she is not seeking help or willing to change her avoidant ways. Soon, her love bombing will be turned off like a faucet, leaving the new partner confused like me.
Any words of encouragement or assurance is much appreciated to help me through this extremely tough time.
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Post by anne12 on Nov 9, 2020 7:28:25 GMT
Hi
DAś normally dont lovebomb.
NARCs lovebomb-. FAś can come on fast. Also APs. FAś (desorganised) more than APs. She could also have bpd.
An extremly traumatic childhood points more to some FA.
People often got a mix of different attatchmenstyles.
She could also have a personality disorder.
Depression can be a freeze state, and then there is not much energy in her system,
Suiside attemts can be anger that is turned inward towards one self.
Common interests are often not enough to build a good healthy relationship.
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Post by iz42 on Nov 9, 2020 8:56:45 GMT
This is here nor there but I have worked in retail and it was exhausting! I’m not sure you can figure out her attachment style based on the fact that she is tired at the end of the day. On a similar note, energy drinks don’t mean she has an addictive personality. Maybe she’s just tired / has a chronic illness / is depressed. I’m sorry that you’re hurt and I get wanting to understand. I just wonder what you’ll get out of trying to diagnose her with a list like this? I don’t think I can tell you whether you dodged a bullet or not  It sounds like you weren’t compatible though and maybe this will give you an opportunity to understand your own attachment style a little better. |
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Post by dullboat123 on Nov 9, 2020 8:57:26 GMT
Hi Anne12, thank you for you reply. I'm not trying to make her a villain. I still love her dearly. I guess my main aim is to sort of comfort myself that it is not all my fault that she made it out to be. And that if she doesn't seek help (unlikely), every relationship she has will be a failure as she self-sabotage the relationship by nit-picking just to satisfy her internal narrative that all relationships are bound to disappoint and fail.
I wouldn't say lovebomb but she was extremely focused on me from the get go. I met her on Tinder and the focus actually made me feel a little unsafe.
I did suspect she might have BPD but what makes you say she has got BPD? Yes she admitted that when she was younger, rage is one of her issues. She hated the world and would assault others just to take it out on them. However in my relationship with her, unfortunately she is very quick to anger too. Which is why even the smallest trip up or thing I said without thinking, would make her pull away and block me - as it triggered my anxious self and went over the top trying to get her attention to apologise. I do feel like I'm constantly stepping on eggshells around her.
She said she did seek a lot of help for her depression when she was younger but it has been more than 10 years since her last therapy. She said she used to cut herself and really did not expect to live past 21. She is 28 now. She was 26 when I first met her and I proved to be so special to her that she even garnered the courage to go back to university to pursue nursing. So much so that for the first time in her life so far, she actually told me first that she wanted to spend her life with me. Which is an insanely huge call for a DA.
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Post by dullboat123 on Nov 9, 2020 9:07:21 GMT
This is here nor there but I have worked in retail and it was exhausting! I’m not sure you can figure out her attachment style based on the fact that she is tired at the end of the day. On a similar note, energy drinks don’t mean she has an addictive personality. Maybe she’s just tired / has a chronic illness / is depressed. I’m sorry that you’re hurt and I get wanting to understand. I just wonder what you’ll get out of trying to diagnose her with a list like this? Yes I understand that retail is tiring work. However she is tired all the time, even on weekends, after she had more than 12 hour sleep. Simple adulting tasks tire her, like sorting out missed payment of Netflix or rental issue. She admitted herself that she has an addictive personality and it runs in the family. Her addiction to energy drinks/soda is quite severe. No she doesn't have any chronic illnesses but yes she might be depressed and certainly did not tell me or wanting to seek help. I actually offered her to go on my company's free Employees Assistance Program to speak to a therapist and she turned it down. So really, I tried to get her help but she rejected it. I can't really push further so as to not force it on her that she has problems cause that can come across as insulting. At the end of the day, I am not trying to make her a villain. I am just trying to understand that with her issues and trauma, it is really not completely my fault that the relationship imploded. From the day of the break up, she is pretty adamant that I'm at fault because I've never heard a single word from her taking any responsibilities. |
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Post by anne12 on Nov 9, 2020 10:42:35 GMT
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Post by Helsbells on Nov 9, 2020 16:23:55 GMT
Hi all, Hope everyone is keeping safe in this pandemic. I am going through a very painful break up as I think I was love addicted due to me being AP. As the subject title suggests, I (AP with DA/ was secure in 10 years of previous marriage) have been dumped by a DA female (some signs but not all) in June 2020 after 1.5 years. It was over for the fact that I let my insecurities get in the way by constantly clawing for the DA ex's reassurance which she is unwilling to give. Hence my "incessant questions" for reassurance made her always feeling on edge and nervous. She broke it off after I accuse her of cheating - due to some of her behaviours which are questionable and the lack of reassurance. Her leaving, without her saying, is all my fault. Its none of hers as she did not indicate she is at any fault. Her only real relationship was the one before me for close to 5 years. As I understood, her ex boyfriend spends most time gaming or hanging out with his friend/housemate in the living room while she lies on the bed surfing the net or watching movies. She was pretty much neglected. Which worked for so long because for DA, one of the main traits is "We are good but as long as we are not in the same room". Though I am consciously and actively seeking therapy and showing huge improvements, every little missteps will make her pull away, blocking me for a month and coming back. She had blocked me twice and both came back after approx a month. The break up caused my anxiety to spiral out of control as I displayed a lot of protest behaviours - going to her house and even once jumped into the back of her car to try to "talk" her into getting back. Those actions did irreparable damage. This time round, she broke it off with me for good as she strung me along while finding someone new. All my efforts to try to work things out are met with "I don't know. I have no plans. I don't want to think about it. I don't want to talk about it.". During courtship, she came on VERY strong. Almost like I am the prey whereby very early on, she said I am the ONLY one she wants to talk to, no one else. I would say it is the DA's way of love bombing to suck me in. Sex and physical contact like holding hands and cuddling are never an issue, though there are a lot of boundaries. However I did proved to her I am special and we met each other's parents and planned to get married and have a child. However it is all talk so it's easy. The break up happened RIGHT before we were to make a big decision to move in together. I was about to propose to her and had already bought her wedding dress. Below is a list of her behaviours which made me think she is a medium DA: 1. Fiercely independent. She would rather struggle and withdraw from me than ask for a hand from me, her partner. 2. Lack of empathy for anyone. However she showed extreme empathy for animals. 3. Not much friends. She has only 2 close, childhood friends. Not a lot of acquaintances. The rest are pushed away/blocked. Even her own biological mother and sister are blocked with no chance of reconciliation. 4. Low energy. Daily life and simple tasks drain her. She works in retail and by the time she comes home everyday, she is drained. Thus most evenings are spent lying on the couch with her almost addicted to surfing Instagram. Not much deep conversations. 5. Conflicts are never resolved with her always going "I don't want to talk about it" or stonewalling. 6. Trouble committing to me or saying "I love you" - we went into a relationship 5 months after dating. To her, it is a record as her previous relationship of 5 years, they only became exclusive after 1.5 years. She said she struggles with saying "I love you" though once she started saying it to me, its frequent. 7. Requires a room of solitude where once she is shut in the room, no disturbances allowed. 8. Addictive personality (she is aware of that) - addicted to energy drinks and sugar in order for her to "cope". Most time spent scrolling Instagram and online. Prone to go down rabbit holes on the internet. 9. Likes to compartmentalise her life. Even me following her friends on Instagram would trigger an extremely angry response. Introducing me to her family and friends are seen as a monumental event. 10. Had tremendously traumatic childhood but often cannot remember much details when asked. Her past seems to be foggy with little titbits of information given to me to try to piece together her childhood. Often shuts down when probed a little. 11. Interaction with her is very surface. There are no deep conversations. She does not ever ask about my family and friends. Seldom ask about my kids. 12. Had depression and attempted but failed many times in taking her own life prior to meeting me. 13. Have next to no patience for anything or anyone. These are just some of the behaviours that made me think she might be a DA. However I love her and adore her as we clicked mentally with very similar interests. Now that the relationship is over, I guess I wanted some assurance from you readers whether I dodged a bullet. She has a new target at the moment, even though it is long distance, I am sure she love bombed him into showing interest. The guy is a social butterfly with many options so falling for someone like my ex over long distance can only seem that he has been love bombed. As much as I want her to be happy, I do not think her new relationship will last as she is not seeking help or willing to change her avoidant ways. Soon, her love bombing will be turned off like a faucet, leaving the new partner confused like me. Any words of encouragement or assurance is much appreciated to help me through this extremely tough time. I experienced almost what you are describing with my ex FA/DA. It almost destroyed me. If you want my honest opinion I think you have dodged a massive bullet as without therapy or awareness she will always show up this way. Blocking and unblocking and distancing behaviour is so confusing and nerve wracking your mental health will end up in tatters. It's nearly 6 mths since we broke up and I'm no way close to being the person I was before he showed up in my life. I am now with a man who calms my nervous system and is totally available on every level for me, but my ex FA has changed me forever, I lost so much of myself after 2.5yrs off being with him. Like you I dont want to paint him as a villain but by god he did some bad damage to me over the years and it has scarred me. |
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Post by Helsbells on Nov 9, 2020 16:28:40 GMT
Also like you, I found myself doing some very unhealthy behaviour and reacting to his dismissive ways in a very protesting way. I have not been triggered once since being with my new man as he hasn't caused me to feel so insecure, so worthless, and so unwanted and so disposable.
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Post by iz42 on Nov 9, 2020 19:06:22 GMT
This is here nor there but I have worked in retail and it was exhausting! I’m not sure you can figure out her attachment style based on the fact that she is tired at the end of the day. On a similar note, energy drinks don’t mean she has an addictive personality. Maybe she’s just tired / has a chronic illness / is depressed. I’m sorry that you’re hurt and I get wanting to understand. I just wonder what you’ll get out of trying to diagnose her with a list like this? Yes I understand that retail is tiring work. However she is tired all the time, even on weekends, after she had more than 12 hour sleep. Simple adulting tasks tire her, like sorting out missed payment of Netflix or rental issue. She admitted herself that she has an addictive personality and it runs in the family. Her addiction to energy drinks/soda is quite severe. No she doesn't have any chronic illnesses but yes she might be depressed and certainly did not tell me or wanting to seek help. I actually offered her to go on my company's free Employees Assistance Program to speak to a therapist and she turned it down. So really, I tried to get her help but she rejected it. I can't really push further so as to not force it on her that she has problems cause that can come across as insulting. At the end of the day, I am not trying to make her a villain. I am just trying to understand that with her issues and trauma, it is really not completely my fault that the relationship imploded. From the day of the break up, she is pretty adamant that I'm at fault because I've never heard a single word from her taking any responsibilities. The actions you’ve described sound much more FA than DA. It sounds like she has some pretty serious psychological issues and perhaps you got caught up thinking you could help her? I totally understand your desire to understand her better. One thing you might also ask yourself is why someone so unstable was attractive to you in the first place. You don’t need to accept responsibility for the breakup just because she refuses to. You were in an anxious avoidant trap with her and if you read other stories here, you’ll see that those rarely end well. |
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Post by alexandra on Nov 9, 2020 22:19:14 GMT
I agree with Anne that she's likely FA and/or BPD. You said she completely lacks empathy and has a history of suicide attempts. That is not explained by attachment style and is associated with severe mental health issues and fits a personality disorder such as BPD. However, we cannot diagnose her.
I would strongly recommend you consider the following: you are looking for external validation (probably from your therapist, from strangers here) that perhaps you dodged a bullet and perhaps this is not all your fault. You also take credit for being so good for her that she was able to stay in a relationship and go back to school. This means, you do not feel confident in trusting and validating yourself, you are not able to regulate your own emotions and you look for others to do it for you, and you also look to in turn regulate the emotions of others (you did not cause her to go back to school, for example. While you may have helpfully provided her with some stability, she made the decision... you do not have the power, control, or responsibility to make anyone else do anything. You only control yourself.) Everything I just said isn't criticism, it's an extremely typical characteristic of AP and something you should discuss with your therapist.
All of your focus on your ex, the extremely long and meticulous multiple posts detailing her without focusing as much on yourself, feels to your AP side like it will help you, but it won't. It's allowing you to avoid your negative feelings that you'd need to confront in focusing on yourself.
This wasn't all your fault. It takes two to tango, is the saying. She avoids responsibility, she avoids therapy, clearly she's not being mindful of her side of the relationship, and nothing you could have done would change that. But I strongly suspect you have a lot of trauma in your background if you can look at that long list of unacceptable behaviors and assess that she simply is "mild DA." Because that means at some point these behaviors were normalized enough for you to tolerate.
I also hope your therapist is familiar with treating partners of people with BPD. Believe it or not, they do a lot of damage and can be some of the most difficult romantic relationships to recover from. I've heard that after a relationship with someone with a personality disorder, once you start recovering from the breakup, having distance from the person, finding yourself, it's been described as "coming out of a fog." I suspect you'll end up getting to that point to if you really start looking into why you'd have accepted a partner treating you this way and dig deeper into your AP history as you heal.
Good luck! I'm sorry you went through this, and I do believe if you shift focus back to yourself, you'll soon see and believe this wasn't your fault or within your control, and you deserve a lot better than you received here. She'd never be a good partner. But you need to have strong enough boundaries also to walk away once a relationship turns toxic like this.
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 9, 2020 22:49:23 GMT
Hi there...welcome to these forums. I recognize so much of what you are saying about yourself...the clinging, the needing external validation....the hot/cold, on/off aspects of the relationship. I am so sorry it is so painful. When the guy I was dating broke up with me...my world literally felt upside down.....when I found my way here....I just wanted to understand why it happened and why he behaved the way he did....which led me to behave the way I did. It is very normal for APs to come here with questions regarding their ex partner...the thing is.....I never got answers that were truly satisfying and that is because as much as I thought I needed to look at and understand everything about him...it was really that I needed to turn the focus back to myself. I needed to ask myself why, in the face of so much incompatibility and inconsistency I stayed...even while it was hurting me to do so. Since this is all fresh for you, please take the time you feel is needed to explore your questions about her behavior etc......but at some point, it will be beneficial to start looking at why you chose her, why you stayed with her, how did she make you feel and why, if those feeling were mostly bad did you decide to stick it out...it is fine if now is not the time for those answers.
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Post by lovebunny on Nov 9, 2020 22:57:47 GMT
Does it really matter if she's FA, BPD, or just not that into you? I understand wanting to understand, but in the end, you've described someone who isn't relationship material for you. You can't have deep talks with her. She doesn't have energy at the end of the day to anything with you, instead wants to f around on insta. She doesn't want to commit to you, doesn't want you to know her friends.
A better question to ask than "What's wrong with her?" is "Why would I accept this in a partner?" Breakups suck, but eventually, you'll find you're just fine without this woman. Chin up!
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Post by dullboat123 on Nov 9, 2020 23:12:46 GMT
I experienced almost what you are describing with my ex FA/DA. It almost destroyed me. If you want my honest opinion I think you have dodged a massive bullet as without therapy or awareness she will always show up this way. Blocking and unblocking and distancing behaviour is so confusing and nerve wracking your mental health will end up in tatters. It's nearly 6 mths since we broke up and I'm no way close to being the person I was before he showed up in my life. I am now with a man who calms my nervous system and is totally available on every level for me, but my ex FA has changed me forever, I lost so much of myself after 2.5yrs off being with him. Like you I dont want to paint him as a villain but by god he did some bad damage to me over the years and it has scarred me. You're right. My mind is a mush now and the pain of losing her is affecting every single minute of my life now. This is compounded by the fact that I am all alone here with not too many friends to talk to. The isolation is driving me to think of ways to end my life. Yes I know she is not good for me but we've been together for 1.5 years and the first year was the most wonderful time I've ever had in the 40 years of my life. I certainly had lost myself in this toxic relationship but I don't know why I am grieving this so much. It hurts so much. |
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Post by dullboat123 on Nov 9, 2020 23:25:53 GMT
I agree with Anne that she's likely FA and/or BPD. You said she completely lacks empathy and has a history of suicide attempts. That is not explained by attachment style and is associated with severe mental health issues and fits a personality disorder such as BPD. However, we cannot diagnose her. I would strongly recommend you consider the following: you are looking for external validation (probably from your therapist, from strangers here) that perhaps you dodged a bullet and perhaps this is not all your fault. You also take credit for being so good for her that she was able to stay in a relationship and go back to school. This means, you do not feel confident in trusting and validating yourself, you are not able to regulate your own emotions and you look for others to do it for you, and you also look to in turn regulate the emotions of others (you did not cause her to go back to school, for example. While you may have helpfully provided her with some stability, she made the decision... you do not have the power, control, or responsibility to make anyone else do anything. You only control yourself.) Everything I just said isn't criticism, it's an extremely typical characteristic of AP and something you should discuss with your therapist. All of your focus on your ex, the extremely long and meticulous multiple posts detailing her without focusing as much on yourself, feels to your AP side like it will help you, but it won't. It's allowing you to avoid your negative feelings that you'd need to confront in focusing on yourself. This wasn't all your fault. It takes two to tango, is the saying. She avoids responsibility, she avoids therapy, clearly she's not being mindful of her side of the relationship, and nothing you could have done would change that. But I strongly suspect you have a lot of trauma in your background if you can look at that long list of unacceptable behaviors and assess that she simply is "mild DA." Because that means at some point these behaviors were normalized enough for you to tolerate. I also hope your therapist is familiar with treating partners of people with BPD. Believe it or not, they do a lot of damage and can be some of the most difficult romantic relationships to recover from. I've heard that after a relationship with someone with a personality disorder, once you start recovering from the breakup, having distance from the person, finding yourself, it's been described as "coming out of a fog." I suspect you'll end up getting to that point to if you really start looking into why you'd have accepted a partner treating you this way and dig deeper into your AP history as you heal. Good luck! I'm sorry you went through this, and I do believe if you shift focus back to yourself, you'll soon see and believe this wasn't your fault or within your control, and you deserve a lot better than you received here. She'd never be a good partner. But you need to have strong enough boundaries also to walk away once a relationship turns toxic like this. You are right about me. I do have some childhood trauma which lead me to have this deep fear of abandonment. I have been working with my therapist to try to be a better person. One interesting thing is that I was married for 10 years and have never has my insecurity been so triggered than a relationship with a DA. One interesting thing to note is that I found that my ex wife, is a narcissist. The 10 years with her is full of both emotional and physical abuse. Hence pain for me is normalised. That might explain why I put up with so much crap with the DA ex because I'm used to the stonewalling. I'm used to the one chasing and I'm used to being made to feel I'm worthless. The only thing that kept me with the DA was that there isn't physical abuse. Yes I can say that this break up with my DA ex is even worse than my marriage break up of 10 years with 2 kids! |
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Post by dullboat123 on Nov 9, 2020 23:33:52 GMT
The actions you’ve described sound much more FA than DA. It sounds like she has some pretty serious psychological issues and perhaps you got caught up thinking you could help her? I totally understand your desire to understand her better. One thing you might also ask yourself is why someone so unstable was attractive to you in the first place. You don’t need to accept responsibility for the breakup just because she refuses to. You were in an anxious avoidant trap with her and if you read other stories here, you’ll see that those rarely end well. I now think that she has some pretty serious psychological issues as many of you had confirmed it. As a guy, I think she appeals to me physically too because she is a very attractive woman. Within the relationship, she told me that there are a constant stream of men trying to hit on her and even offering her gifts for sex. This does trigger my insecurities and low self esteem. Also, she is from another race and I really enjoy taking the time to get to know her culture. Yes I recognised that I am in a AP/DA dance and it will not end well. However we are no longer in that dance as she had found someone else, even though it is long distance, it absolutely suits her DA style. What hurts me was that she strung me along while already being emotionally invested in the other guy (though we are not in a relationship). She came back trying to fix things with me while already being emotionally invested somewhere else. I still showered her with gifts and free meals. Now that the guy confirmed that he is interested in her, she said the most hurtful things to me and cut me loose. My heart feels like it's being stomped on while typing this because I feel a bit betrayed. |
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It sounds like you weren’t compatible though and maybe this will give you an opportunity to understand your own attachment style a little better. 
