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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2018 13:22:38 GMT
Has anyone noticed an intense desire to win someone over - to prove that you are exactly everything they want, even if you don't really want them?
It's kind of messed up, but I'm telling it how it is for me: I definitely have this impulse for validation that diminishes the other person, their free will, their hopes, dreams, wishes and their own pain.
I no longer act on these impulses like I used to but they are difficult to live with.
The act of accepting that reality lives in the tension of being being good enough and also not being enough for somebody else has not been easy, and I consistently find myself wishing I was better in bed, or prettier, or more interesting - a fantasy of fortifying myself fully from the risk of heartbreak? It isn't possible. Like Brene Brown says, the capacity to be whole hearted can never be greater than your willingness to be broken hearted. To fully experience love, I have to risk integrity and accept that as a consequence, this will rule out potential lovers if they are also embracing their own integrity. I must accept that heartache is the risk I take to be true to myself. It's an interesting idea, when in embracing myself, I can cause the very rejection that makes me tap into my original parental rejection, that actually makes me question whether the real me is enough. So in allowing myself to be "rejected", I have to trust that I accept this rejection without changing myself because I am enough as I am and not accept this as new evidence of the contrary.
I feel like I must work towards debunking and questioning my desires and the motivations behind them - why do I want this from the other person?
I must work towards opening up to the greater truth of the other person, as well as myself, and open myself up to seeing their wants and desires not as a rejection, but as a deep wish within them that deserves to be fulfilled and that it is another person's suffering at hand here, not just my own.
I must learn to empathise, not objectify.
Just some thoughts.
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 23, 2018 13:30:19 GMT
In my highest moment, I agree with you.....it becomes a selfish desire to prove that I am worthy over and over and over again. And yes...it then denies someone the opportunity to be authentic because my need trumps whatever else is going on. I think however...the majority of people are unaware of this trap...and those of us who are aware of it were not really provided a good example of getting out of it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2018 13:39:20 GMT
In my highest moment, I agree with you.....it becomes a selfish desire to prove that I am worthy over and over and over again. And yes...it then denies someone the opportunity to be authentic because my need trumps whatever else is going on. I think however...the majority of people are unaware of this trap...and those of us who are aware of it were not really provided a good example of getting out of it. Oh it was so unconscious for me and even now that I am conscious of it, it's an internal street fight to not act out on the plans of reconciliation that arise in my mind, I just notice them. It's incredibly difficult to not only get out, but stay out. It's like being an addict, you can only take this a day at a time I think, like today I will not be moved. Just for today. Tomorrow is a battle for my future self, I just have to focus on my integrity in this moment. I think we are the lucky ones, even if we are awake to the pain of this, at least this affords us a wider window of choice, that can and will widen over time  It's also important I think to note that relapse is also expected in other reforms from addictions, and I think that we are no different, as long as we lessen those over time |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2018 13:42:06 GMT
It's important to include that it is my higher self talking to my lower self when I write - I find writing it really helps me realise it more fully
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Post by leavethelighton on Nov 24, 2018 1:49:11 GMT
Yes. For me that has manifested as wanting to not give up so as to somehow prove my reliability, integrity, truth, etc. To somehow show I'd be there for them when everyone else has fallen.
It's hard to give up even when I know continuing to try is not my best interest. And if I'm not trying to maintain the relationship or reconcile, I'm wondering if I should.
Giving up can be a form of self love. But that doesn't make it easy to do.
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Post by faithopelove on Nov 24, 2018 3:38:18 GMT
Hmmm...I’ve only not given up on one guy in my life. I’ve always been the one to leave- although it takes a while for me to let go. My last bf though I’d still like to see it work but he’s very tough DA with depression. I’ve never felt both physical desire and love for a partner before like I do for this guy. Praying for his depression.
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 24, 2018 11:12:13 GMT
I was thinking more about this and I think for me...it boils down to the fact that I was the black sheep in my family and I tend to fall for other black sheep....and there is this "I won't treat you the way my patents (and probably your parents) treated me (you)...I won't give up on you because I know the experience of being abandoned/not seen." But then...there is this entitlement that also implies that if I am not giving up on you, then you also should not give up on me. So it is trying to coerce a relationship that I want by not giving up. It is so tricky to give that pattern up though....it is what I am used to.....and my worth becomes tied up in it.
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Post by ocarina on Nov 24, 2018 23:36:40 GMT
Could there be something in here along the lines of winning in order to make you feel worthy? To prove to yourself that you're valuable? The getting stuck in the hamster wheel of self validation by achievement rather than an inherent feeling of self worth and self compassion that means behaving in a way that is loving to oneself - even if this means giving up on a relationship that's hurting you?
My gut feeling is that anyone who feels secure and comfortable in their own (flawed) humanity does not engage in relationships that are hurtful, or stay longer than they should. I don't equate this to self esteem or thinking highly of oneself, more a kind and compassionate kind of self acceptance that is really helpful in building resilience and navigating the inevitable ups and downs with humility.
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 25, 2018 20:45:53 GMT
Could there be something in here along the lines of winning in order to make you feel worthy? To prove to yourself that you're valuable? The getting stuck in the hamster wheel of self validation by achievement rather than an inherent feeling of self worth and self compassion that means behaving in a way that is loving to oneself - even if this means giving up on a relationship that's hurting you? My gut feeling is that anyone who feels secure and comfortable in their own (flawed) humanity does not engage in relationships that are hurtful, or stay longer than they should. I don't equate this to self esteem or thinking highly of oneself, more a kind and compassionate kind of self acceptance that is really helpful in building resilience and navigating the inevitable ups and downs with humility. There definately is that aspect as well...at least for me....but it has o be with someone that mirrors the inconsistency....it can't be someone who accepts me right away or all the time or I will get bored. |
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mel
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Post by mel on Nov 26, 2018 14:46:16 GMT
What tnr9 said: "So it is trying to coerce a relationship that I want by not giving up."
Hahaha! Yep.
I was reading a book by Mira Kirschbaum about the need to quickly "dump the duds" and move on, quantified by noting that dating/relationships are a numbers game, and the longer you stay with a 'dud' the more good possibilities you are missing out on.
It is hard to concede defeat and move on, but it is the only practical thing I think.
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