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Post by Dualcitizen on Mar 4, 2020 1:55:43 GMT
Guys,
For those of you who have read this, I just would like your advice and commentary please.
As I noted in the F-A thread, I have shown my ex. girl the kindle version to download and read. She's mentioned she's going to actually read enoute to meet a childhood friend.
I fear it may potentially cause some grief if she comes to any realisations. Would this mindfulness of mine be misplaced? Could it cause an emotional flashback there and then or some dissociation etc?
I have already said to her if she reads it, she needs to be ready to confront anything from the past, it may make her upset, and if it would, it may not suit her just yet to read. I told her to make sure she feels ready to handle what it may uncover.
I think that's all I can really say to her, I have warned and been mindful.
How have those of you who have read it reacted if you don't mind me asking? (particularly any F-A leaning people obviously)
thanks
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Post by Dualcitizen on Mar 4, 2020 3:16:09 GMT
@dualcitizen I've read a lot of the book (still working to finish it), and while I'm not FA and only have emotional neglect, here are my thoughts: I think your pre-warning was good and should cover it... it's really all you can do. I'd think anymore would be crossing boundaries and too much... also, she'd be reading a book called "CPTSD: From Surviving to Thriving" — so it's also a precursor to what she's getting into (even though the book is way more than that, I understand). If she actually starts to read it (which would take a lot to do in itself), and it's too much for her, she'll just stop reading at the first (or first couple) triggers and I'd guess block out. If she does read it, it might take a bit to process, and I'm not sure if it's cause emotional flashbacks or dissociation... maybe? Obviously I don't know her, but that'd be my guess. It's good she's going to meet a childhood friend, that could be safe too even if she's triggered or impacted strongly/negatively. What I would probably do is not bring up the book until she does, as you've put it out there and you don't want to over flood. But I'd be curious to hear what others say. For me, the book felt really easy to read and digest — not too harsh, but there were some things that felt so on point that I did have to put it down from time to time just to take it in. I can imagine the reaction being a lot stronger being less aware and coming from a place of severe FA-ness and/or stronger abuse. But all of that said, as I mentioned in the FA thread, the book is incredible — and I thank you so much for sharing the recommendation. I've been thinking about sharing some quotes on here for more discussion at parts that stood out. Thanks Caroline appreciate the input. Just want to make sure she's ok as possible bringing all this up |
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Post by serenity on Mar 4, 2020 4:18:00 GMT
I was thinking the same thing as Caroline pretty much. Let her bring it up if she wants to, otherwise it might seem very intrusive.
I have three sisters, some who've gradually taken onboard info about Narc abuse and C-PTSD, others who stayed in denial (because it threatened the premise of current relationships, such as with Narc mother and partner). If someone's not ready for it, they will just go into denial. If you put pressure on, they might reject you, which would be hurtful for you.
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Post by Dualcitizen on Mar 4, 2020 5:44:16 GMT
I was thinking the same thing as Caroline pretty much. Let her bring it up if she wants to, otherwise it might seem very intrusive. I have three sisters, some who've gradually taken onboard info about Narc abuse and C-PTSD, others who stayed in denial (because it threatened the premise of current relationships, such as with Narc mother and partner). If someone's not ready for it, they will just go into denial. If you put pressure on, they might reject you, which would be hurtful for you. Thanks Serenity |
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Post by serenity on Mar 4, 2020 20:19:14 GMT
I was thinking the same thing as Caroline pretty much. Let her bring it up if she wants to, otherwise it might seem very intrusive. I have three sisters, some who've gradually taken onboard info about Narc abuse and C-PTSD, others who stayed in denial (because it threatened the premise of current relationships, such as with Narc mother and partner). If someone's not ready for it, they will just go into denial. If you put pressure on, they might reject you, which would be hurtful for you. Thanks Serenity Hey Dualcitizen! I was cleaning up my PC desktop and found this...part of an article I found once, that I kept as a reminder. Thought you might appreciate it too, as someone who really cares about the people who come into your life: Rescuing versus enabling - the differences
People we love sometimes need help, and for those of us with a great deal of empathy, compassion and perhaps some `rescuing' skills, our instinct is to stay and help, rather than simply abandon someone we love in trouble. This is something i personally admire, support and encourage. To me, compassion is a crucial part fo social cohesion and security on both a larger scale, and on a personal level. There is also a mutual benefit helping loved ones and friends, in that many times we have entwined our survival and emotional needs in with this person, and if we can help them, our lives will improve too. So when are we crossing the line, from helpign to enabling ? 1. Pick our causes: Try to identify Can the person be helped? Some mental health issues can't be helped. Others would drain all our resources and energy if we tried. Others can be helped with the support of professionals.You don't have to do it all on your own. Helping: Assisting others Enabling: Allowing ourselves to be harmed 2. What is our role? Support and encouragment. 3. What are our boundaries? |
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Post by Dualcitizen on Mar 4, 2020 21:23:02 GMT
Hey Dualcitizen! I was cleaning up my PC desktop and found this...part of an article I found once, that I kept as a reminder. Thought you might appreciate it too, as someone who really cares about the people who come into your life: Rescuing versus enabling - the differences
People we love sometimes need help, and for those of us with a great deal of empathy, compassion and perhaps some `rescuing' skills, our instinct is to stay and help, rather than simply abandon someone we love in trouble. This is something i personally admire, support and encourage. To me, compassion is a crucial part fo social cohesion and security on both a larger scale, and on a personal level. There is also a mutual benefit helping loved ones and friends, in that many times we have entwined our survival and emotional needs in with this person, and if we can help them, our lives will improve too. So when are we crossing the line, from helpign to enabling ? 1. Pick our causes: Try to identify Can the person be helped? Some mental health issues can't be helped. Others would drain all our resources and energy if we tried. Others can be helped with the support of professionals.You don't have to do it all on your own. Helping: Assisting others Enabling: Allowing ourselves to be harmed 2. What is our role? Support and encouragment. 3. What are our boundaries? Yep good post and points to keep in mind for sure. The boundaries are big, and this is where it can flip over into the murky waters of codependency and the "entwined our survival and emotional needs with this person" as mentioned above. That certainly wont be happening. If there is more movement on her part (which is limited at this time), I'd recommend she see a professional (she hasn't mentioned this, and so I presume she's not at this stage), as this clearly needs to be all done in tandem with someone who has extensively worked with trauma before, instead of the "run of the mill" therapist from reading many people's opinions, and their recovery/experiences. I see "my role" as purely a catalyst if anything, if I could remotely spark that awareness, for her to explore, that would be job done for me. And yes any remote support/encouragement as she moves forward. I would love to hear her story of moving forward, explaining what she had learnt, and see that self love, self esteem, her boundaries grow, and not be "dependent" on another for love/happiness, that she is empowered, that would make me eternally happy longer term. It's definitely not my job to fix, nor do I have the capabilities to do that anyway, I have pushed the boundaries already as discussed in the other thread I feel. The only other issue I can see is the Narcissistic parent. If my name is mentioned in lieu of awakening her, this could be also a problem if they decide to act out of vengeance. I'd just handle that as required at the time. On a sidenote, there is a risk of "transference" as well, which could be problematic. In relation to inner workings of how the "hurt super ego" can actually turn around and start to blame the person/try and hurt the person trying to help, they end up being the "bad guy", normally the therapist would be on receiving end. Don't want any of that happening clearly. I appreciate the heads up on the thought process. |
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Post by serenity on Mar 5, 2020 1:36:24 GMT
I like your idea of suggesting a trauma therapist, rather than a run of the mill therapist, if she mentions it again. Finding the right mental health resources for Narc Abuse is also tricky, but there's a lot of resources on the internet.
Something that occurred to me, is if she's never looked for help herself, in spite of such a horrific background, then be wary of her potentially `playing the victim' as her way to have people rescue her (and pay her way through life). Not saying she's a bad person or consciously manipulative, but `playing the victim' is not the same as wanting empowerment and responsibility for one's own issues.
People who can manipulate rescuers get an awful lot out of it, from money, avoiding responsibilities they don't want, and a lot of attention. One of my sisters is like this, and I've watched her rescuer husband try to help her for 20 years now. She doesn't want to work, she manipulated him into being the breadwinner by lying about contraception and having unplanned pregnancies they had agreed not to have(she already had two kids from another marriage). Even with her kids grown up now, she still refuses to work. When she has gone into therapy, she used it as more fodder for playing the victim, rather than empowering herself and her marriage. She comes across as a lovely soft vulnerable woman and I love her. But her behaviour has a ruthlessness to it, and I can say she's never the rock for anyone else, in spite of how much people have helped her.
So yeah, I like how intelligent and guarded you are being. I hope for the sake of your friendship and also for her sake, she isn't like my sister.
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Post by Dualcitizen on Mar 5, 2020 1:56:43 GMT
I like your idea of suggesting a trauma therapist, rather than a run of the mill therapist, if she mentions it again. Finding the right mental health resources for Narc Abuse is also tricky, but there's a lot of resources on the internet. Something that occurred to me, is if she's never looked for help herself, in spite of such a horrific background, then be wary of her potentially `playing the victim' as her way to have people rescue her (and pay her way through life). Not saying she's a bad person or consciously manipulative, but `playing the victim' is not the same as wanting empowerment and responsibility for one's own issues. People who can manipulate rescuers get an awful lot out of it, from money, avoiding responsibilities they don't want, and a lot of attention. One of my sisters is like this, and I've watched her rescuer husband try to help her for 20 years now. She doesn't want to work, she manipulated him into being the breadwinner by lying about contraception and having unplanned pregnancies they had agreed not to have(she already had two kids from another marriage). Even with her kids grown up now, she still refuses to work. When she has gone into therapy, she used it as more fodder for playing the victim, rather than empowering herself and her marriage. She comes across as a lovely soft vulnerable woman and I love her. But her behaviour has a ruthlessness to it, and I can say she's never the rock for anyone else, in spite of how much people have helped her. So yeah, I like how intelligent and guarded you are being. I hope for the sake of your friendship and also for her sake, she isn't like my sister. Good points Serenity, don't worry i'll be on the look out, I would never ever be used like that by the way, but I appreciate the warning for sure, it's something to think about, as there are those amongst us out there that take full advantage of kind deeds. Pretty much now i've given her some framework, so I wont be really bringing much else up, she would havew to show signs she's reading up and making an effort from here to be honest. |
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