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Post by lovebunny on May 11, 2021 19:00:43 GMT
I almost always struggle during holidays, anytime you're "supposed" to be surrounded by a loving family and close friends. But Mother's day didn't used to bother me until I fell in love with a man with kids. So this might be more about me being a lonely person than my anxious avoidant lovestyle, not sure, I'm coming here for a reality check.
When I didn't hear from my boyfriend of over a year all Sunday, I figured he was with his ex wife and kids. I don't usually feel jealous of his ex, though they're close. I understand that they've known each other since they were 16 (we're in our late 40's) and she's raising his kids, ages 12 & 15, who live full-time with her.
I tried to ignore my feelings of neglect. I videochatted for 15 minutes with my mom, dad, and grandmother who live across the country. I haven't seen them in person for years and we're not what I'd consider "close." I visited a friend I hadn't seen in a while who is fostering kittens. I tried to just have a good day and didn't text bf except to respond in kind to his goodnight text.
Monday bf came over, and I learned he'd taken ex and kids out on his boat, and when I asked outright "Why wasn't I invited?" (knowing his ex has been asking to meet me) he didn't have much of an answer except that he didn't want his exwife and his girlfriend on his boat at the same time. I'm guessing this has more to do with ex than with me, he paints her as rather volatile, and I know he had problems with her not getting along with his brother or his mother. I just couldn't help feeling resentful, knowing I'd been intentionally excluded while he honored her as mother of his kids.
Is it weird that I haven't met the mother of his children after a year of dating? Is it "normal" that I've met the kids just once, very briefly, though their father and I talk about moving in together down the road? I can't tell if the problem here is that he's not properly integrating me into his life, or if that's not really something he's supposed to be doing yet, or if it's not really going to happen. He knows I don't particularly care for children, but it's not like I'd be mean to them, I do fine with kids in small doses, I deal with them plenty in my service industry job.
Mother's day triggered me on another level too, in that I do not have siblings, nieces, nephews, or children of my own. This makes me worry no one will look out for me when I'm old. When I confessed this to bf, I mentioned I'd sometimes fantasized about adopting an older kid someday, and he reminded me he didn't want more kids. I don't know that I want that either, I mean, I'm nearly 50, still working full-time and will probably never realistically have the time or money. But I feel like bf isn't SEEING me in this situation, because he's already got a family and his kids adore him and will probably be there for him in his dotage.
I don't even know what I want him to do. Do I even want to be a part of his family, when they include a difficult ex and kids to whom I'll never be more than "Dad's girlfriend?" (Bf says he doesn't want to legally marry again. I'm pretty sure that document is something I can live without, too, as I've already been there done that.)
Now he's all worried my "biological clock is ticking," but I don't think that's it.
The truth is, I don't associate notion of "family" with warm fuzzies and fun. I've always gotten my affection and validation through romantic partners, sometimes good friends. All this came up and left me in tears. I realize that one is not supposed to rely on one's partner for everything, but I don't come with a ready-made sense of "family," so I look to my partner to provide it. It hurt to feel outside looking in on his happy little family on Mother's Day.
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Post by anne12 on May 11, 2021 20:18:45 GMT
How often does he see his kids ?
Why do they live Full time with their mother ?
Was his last relationship before he met you with the mother of his children or ?
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Post by lovebunny on May 11, 2021 21:00:56 GMT
Hi Ann, well, if it paints the picture better...He sees the kids on average once a week, maybe twice. I don't think joint custody was ever an option, his ex loves motherhood, while he's happy being fun dad who swoops in once a week to do something together or helps with science project or fix things around their house. His side of the story is that he didn't really want fatherhood, felt pressured into it by ex and both their parents, and of course he loves his kids but got a vasectomy after the second.
He had one other longterm relationship between exwife and me, lasted 3 years, and she did spend time with the ex and kids, but I don't think the kids got too attached to her.
I almost wonder if there's something in his relationship with his ex that he doesn't want me to see, some way he is with her that he feels reflects on him badly.
That's the thing, I want to think this doesn't have much to do with ME, it isn't proof that he doesn't love me or take me seriously as a potential life partner, but there's some way that he's compartmentalizing me away from this huge part of his life that is off-putting.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2021 1:46:26 GMT
Hi lovebunny, If I were dating a man who didn't particularly like children, I wouldn't bring him around my kids. This is because children are perceptive. They have a good sense of whether or not a person is truly warm. I wouldn't want my kids to be uncomfortable around my boyfriend, I would compartmentalize that too. My kids are a priority and their emotions, and feelings of inclusion are important to me. It's not like adults really, where you can expect to be cordial and that's good for everybody. I think kids have a little higher expectation of being appreciate for who they are , and cared for, when it comes to adults in their personal lives. I'm not saying you are bad for kids, please don't take it that way. But I get the impression from your post you would more tolerate than enjoy them. You didn't say you would like to get to know them and contribute to their well being. That's just my take, I'd be somewhat leery to put my kids in a position to feel awkward or uncomfortable with my partner. It would seem more peaceful for them. And for me, to be honest. And, maybe for my partner! I don't know if you two have had a very open talk about it or have avoided it. That said, I can understand you feeling left out about it. But, that's one of the complications of dating in later life when kids are involved. Have you asked him specifically what's on his heart and mind about the subject, not being around the kids? Have you told him your vulnerable feelings around it? I ask because I'm seeing that I tend to conceal my most vulnerable feelings and approach discomfort with defensiveness. I'm not saying you are doing that, just opening the thought in case you see it in yourself. Negative assumptions create a whole lot of pain and problems and sometimes they crop up when we don't have authentic communication. |
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2021 3:36:35 GMT
I forgot to add, there are a couple other scenarios that occur to me as a woman who has dated with kids. Kids sometimes are not interested in meeting a girlfriend or boyfriend. Especially if they were around his previous partner for three years and it ended- they may like to sit this one out. Dad also might be trying to avoid having women in and out of their lives. If you guys progress to the point of living together then maybe that would be re-addressed. But a once or twice a week parenting time arrangement seems likely to be focused on parenting time, and it doesn't seem unreasonable to me to exclude a partner from that time especially if they don't really care for kids. He may not be involved for a lot of clock time with his kids but it sounds like pretty good quality time.
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Post by lovebunny on May 12, 2021 13:39:15 GMT
Thank you, introvert. That's very reassuring and makes sense, looking at it from his perspective as a father. He's the first person I've ever dated with kids, and though intellectually, I understand they take priority over me, and of course I WANT him to be a good father to his kids, the neglected child inside ME alternates between sympathy for them not having their beloved father around much and wanting him all to myself.
I think in this particular mother's day situation I was feeling secondary to his kids' mother (and sad that my relationship to my own mother is lacking,) but now that I've calmed some I think it probably had more to do with him spending quality time with his kids than with her. He may feel like he can't give them his full attention if I'm around, he's usually very focused on me if I'm in the room even around others (not because I demand it, he's just attentive like that.)
I've gathered that his last ex WANTED to be involved with his kids in a way I don't. She actually wanted her own babies, but since he was "fixed" she instead sought a stepmom role. He told me the kids weren't sad when things ended, but his exwife had become good friends with her and that was harder. He told me his exwife actually said something about wanting ME to help pick up kids from school and stuff, and I admit it never occurred to me that helping with the kids might be something I'd be asked to do.
I could really help myself here by trying to open up to caring for his kids on a personal level,(not just sort of vaguely because of course I care about the well-being of children.) I suspect you're right when you say his kids might not have much interest in me, or possibly even dislike my existence. My bf might be trying to spare my feelings by not telling me his kids want nothing to do with me. His youngest, I'm told, is very sensitive, and a daddy's girl, and when we met she didn't speak a single word to me, not even when I asked her a question directly. Her and I warming up to each other might be beyond us right now, but I could probably get on fairly easily with his oldest, who is more confident and mature, and he and I actually share some geeky interests. I almost want to suggest to bf that he do something to bring me and the boy together, but then maybe little girl would feel excluded? She looks up to her big brother, maybe if he likes me, she will too? I don't know, I try not to push him about this, he knows what's best for his kids.
We have not talked much about bf's feelings on this, I suspect he's fine with compartmentalizing. He always prefers the easiest path and is eternally optimistic that things meant to happen will just happen. I tend to want to be more proactive.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2021 13:55:30 GMT
I'm glad that my perspective was helpful. It's not natural to have a parent's perspective when you aren't a parent, and also once you're a parent your perspective changes a lot. I can see where the situation would feel painful, with the two drastically different sets of needs around the kids.
It seems to me like Dad is simply trying to take care of everyone here. As a single parent, I have found it important to help my children celebrate their other parent on Father's day. It wasn't so much about him for me, although I appreciate his role he has also been quite problematic in his own dysfunction and we are exes for a reason hah). BUT, it's very damaging to children to alienate a parent and it's also so important to support their love and appreciation for them. So it's really wonderful and a sign of a great dad that he helped them celebrate their Mom on Mother's Day. Maybe in the future you could ease your own loneliness on that day, by letting him know that you have loneliness as someone on the outside of the family thing and you'd love to connect even while you celebrate the fact that he's such a good dad on Mother's Day.
I was a full time mom to my kids and I totally get the mom suggesting you help with pickup. And I get why it wouldn't occur to you! Parenting is a whole different set of concerns and transportation can be huge.
I think it's really difficult to integrate kids and partners when the kids aren't asking for it. They have mom and they spent time with his previous partner... they probably are all set when it comes to adults in their personal life and may not want to go through the process of getting to know you. Also, pre-teens are in a very tough developmental time. So I don't know which child is which... but they are both in remarkably challenging developmental stages. Dad may realize that and not want to expose you to difficult behaviors as well. 12 is transitioning middle to high school, and that is huge and incredibly stressful. 15 is in full blown puberty and it's when my kids turned on me temporarily.
So- it's likely got little to do with you, and more to do with the challenges of parenting.
I hope you feel better about all this. Of course I don't know what is on his mind but maybe if you feel less threatened with the possibilities I've listen here, you would feel more able to approach it without feeling so worried?
EDIT: Reading back I did see you explained which child is older, which child is sensitive. His little girl likely needs him to herself very much right now as she navigates the massive insecurity that comes with middle school to high school transition. I found that cliques get really bad and if there are mean girls around her , if she is sensitive it will be very hard.
Perhaps in time you can enjoy some geeky pursuits with the older one. BUT, at 15, kids are most interested in their peers and are beginning to think adults are lame. This is the age when I had to learn to let them think I'm an aliens who knows nothing, when they were embarrassed by me, etc. They grow out of it in time but this is when they are beginning to push away and find their own selves. It can be fun in a lot of ways and also very rough in others, as a parent.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2021 14:24:50 GMT
Oh! Maybe it will be helpful if I share my own situation here. I have teens at home and I've been in a committed relationship with my boyfriend for over a year. My kids are happy for me that I have this relationship and ask questions, and express support for it. (They are also with me full time so it's more on their radar than your boyfriend's kids may have you on their radar, it's possible.)
My boyfriend is really really great with kids! He has one adult child of his own and was a very involved father. He'd love to do more with my kids. However, on their end, while they have met him and are friendly with him, they are in their independence. They like him very well and really are happy for the both of us, but stay on the outside for the most part.
One of my young adult sons has recently begun to create a relationship with my boyfriend because my boyfriend introduced him to spear fishing. He brought back a huge catch from one of his expeditions and we finally had everyone together for a fish fry... after a year or so of dating. So they are making plans to go spear fishing, and they call and text to talk about that. (I don't spearfish, I won't be along for these adventures but I'll be happy to host a fish fry). I think it's really great, but it's something that happened outside of my influence. I've been really neutral about it with them all, appreciating my boyfriends overtures toward them but putting no pressure on any of them. As I said, I want them to choose what relationships they want to cultivate, because it's so true that at this point in their lives they have totally different stuff on their radar.
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Post by lovebunny on May 12, 2021 17:58:18 GMT
It seems to me like Dad is simply trying to take care of everyone here. As a single parent, I have found it important to help my children celebrate their other parent on Father's day. It wasn't so much about him for me, although I appreciate his role he has also been quite problematic in his own dysfunction and we are exes for a reason hah). BUT, it's very damaging to children to alienate a parent and it's also so important to support their love and appreciation for them. So it's really wonderful and a sign of a great dad that he helped them celebrate their Mom on Mother's Day. Introvert, I find what you said extremely helpful, so thank you again, especially this part above. I'm sure that's exactly what he was doing. He says his ex, despite being a difficult person, is a great mother. I do feel a lot better today, and I'm glad, because I'm seeing bf later. I hate being all sulky and resentful around him, that is not what I want to bring to a relationship. Anne, thank you too! I think "move gently" with a sensitive girl works just fine for me (I'm HSP myself.) I'm sure if he and I move in together, there will naturally be opportunities for interactions, no need to force it before that time. I have no illusions or aspirations of being a "stepmom," these kids are well-parented and moving into young adulthood anyway. But I like the idea of being a friend. Or at least, tolerated on family boating expeditions, lol. One thing I definitely needed, and got, from this thread was that the timeline is "normal," I'm not being left behind in some way just because things are going at a slower and healthier pace than my past relationships. |
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2021 18:06:22 GMT
So glad you feel better. Enjoy your relationship today!  |
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2021 18:07:39 GMT
Also, we have a nice collection of HSP here, of varying styles. I'd love to chat more about that on a thread sometime. Thanks everyone for sharing that.
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