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Post by yasmin on Feb 15, 2018 21:54:43 GMT
I have been thinking a lot today about how much awareness has helped me to feel better, and also thinking over how different my last relationship would have been if both people were aware of their attachment styles and willing to work on it / be understanding of the other person's.
We were both FA, but in the relationship it triggered me to anxious and him to avoidant. We can both switch between the two but that was mostly the dynamic. If we'd both been aware, and been able to have the courage to have an honest conversation about that maybe we could have said....
ME "I really want a relationship, but initially I am quite cold and withdrawn because I find it hard to get close to new people. I'll push you away a lot at first and come up with lots of reasons why I think the relationship won't work, but once I decide to go for it I will become very attached, very quickly. After that, I'll need lots of reassurance and if you blow hot and cold with me it will make me go a little crazy. I need you to be consistent and clear and honest with me during the first few weeks until I feel safe in my choice to let you in.
HIM " I have a fearful avoidant attachment style. I will chase you a lot at first, but once I "get" you, I will instantly start to panic and engage in distancing strategies. These kinds of behaviours can be destructive and can stop relationships dead in their tracks sometimes. They might include pulling away emotionally after an intimate time together, focusing on flaws in the people I am dating instead of seeing their good points, introducing insecurity into the relationship by flirting or dating with others, sending mixed and confusing messages that don’t add up, making it difficult to spend time with me, chasing you when you pull away and distancing myself when you come closer. The most confusing bit is that every time you walk away I will chase after you"
Because we were both in complete denial and totally unaware of our attachment needs so we entered into the toxic push - pull dance that went on for months and months. I'm aware now, he is still completely unaware. He still believes he is searching for "the one" who has not materialised by the age of 47.
I don't think it is that easy to heal attachment wounds, at least I think it will be a very long journey as I can't imagine not being this way -but it's nice to think that if I meet someone and like them that at least I will have awareness on my side. The awareness makes me feel more secure because I understand myself better.
How do you think your relationships would have played out differently with awareness?
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Post by Jaeger on Feb 15, 2018 22:00:26 GMT
I have been thinking a lot today about how much awareness has helped me to feel better, and also thinking over how different my last relationship would have been if both people were aware of their attachment styles and willing to work on it / be understanding of the other person's. We were both FA, but in the relationship it triggered me to anxious and him to avoidant. We can both switch between the two but that was mostly the dynamic. If we'd both been aware, and been able to have the courage to have an honest conversation about that maybe we could have said.... ME "I really want a relationship, but initially I am quite cold and withdrawn because I find it hard to get close to new people. I'll push you away a lot at first and come up with lots of reasons why I think the relationship won't work, but once I decide to go for it I will become very attached, very quickly. After that, I'll need lots of reassurance and if you blow hot and cold with me it will make me go a little crazy. I need you to be consistent and clear and honest with me during the first few weeks until I feel safe in my choice to let you in. HIM " I have a fearful avoidant attachment style. I will chase you a lot at first, but once I "get" you, I will instantly start to panic and engage in distancing strategies. These kinds of behaviours can be destructive and can stop relationships dead in their tracks sometimes. They might include pulling away emotionally after an intimate time together, focusing on flaws in the people I am dating instead of seeing their good points, introducing insecurity into the relationship by flirting or dating with others, sending mixed and confusing messages that don’t add up, making it difficult to spend time with me, chasing you when you pull away and distancing myself when you come closer. The most confusing bit is that every time you walk away I will chase after you"
Because we were both in complete denial and totally unaware of our attachment needs so we entered into the toxic push - pull dance that went on for months and months. I'm aware now, he is still completely unaware. He still believes he is searching for "the one" who has not materialised by the age of 47. I don't think it is that easy to heal attachment wounds, at least I think it will be a very long journey as I can't imagine not being this way -but it's nice to think that if I meet someone and like them that at least I will have awareness on my side. The awareness makes me feel more secure because I understand myself better. How do you think your relationships would have played out differently with awareness? Definitely. To solve any problem, you first have to be aware it exists. Before that awareness, you wouldn't consider it a problem. Sorry for this little joke, as I don't intend it to offend, but it crossed my mind as I typed this reply. Software developers have this habit, when unexpected coding problems arise, of saying "It's not a bug. It's a feature." As long as you consider something that stands in the way of your happiness as a feature, you're unlikely to go through the trouble of sorting through all the code to remove the tiny little bugs to teach the result you wanted, as the vast majority of it is working fine. I think I just outed myself as a huge nerd here, but oh well. The truth will out  Edit: to balance things out, I'm also a kickboxer. Hahahaha |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2018 22:28:27 GMT
I think it's definitely easier to find common ground if both are aware and can talk about it. My last relationship did not have the attachment issues as I have had in the past. (It ended for other reasons)
I told him I was avoidant and he had no idea what that meant. Basically, I told him I will need space, that it's hard for me to trust, etc. I really don't know what his style was, but he was fine with giving me space and alone time whenever I needed it. It made it a lot easier. (He seemed secure to me)
If I had been more aware in my previous relationships of why I was always pulling away, I think I wouldn't have chosen them. I would have realized that the person is not a good fit with my style.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2018 22:35:12 GMT
Now that I think about this some more, it may not have been the awareness, but just the people involved.
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Post by alpenglow on Feb 16, 2018 12:20:11 GMT
I enjoyed your joke, Jaeger, as I'm quite familiar with "It's not a bug. It's a feature."  I have only become fully aware after my last relationship, so I don't know much it actually helps in a relationship, but I'm very curious to try it out! The problem with awareness for insecure people is that it is only the first half of the work. Probably a lot less than half, actually. Awareness goes on a cognitive level, which we can quite easily access and control. It is our embodied emotional reactions that are the problems. And those cannot be fully addressed and resolved using awareness alone I'm afraid. I actually get more and more frustrated with awareness. It's like knowing it, but your emotions going a different way. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2018 13:35:46 GMT
I enjoyed your joke, Jaeger, as I'm quite familiar with "It's not a bug. It's a feature." I have only become fully aware after my last relationship, so I don't know much it actually helps in a relationship, but I'm very curious to try it out! The problem with awareness for insecure people is that it is only the first half of the work. Probably a lot less than half, actually. Awareness goes on a cognitive level, which we can quite easily access and control. It is our embodied emotional reactions that are the problems. And those cannot be fully addressed and resolved using awareness alone I'm afraid. I actually get more and more frustrated with awareness. It's like knowing it, but your emotions going a different way. This is so right. Being aware I get more frustrated with myself. I guess I took awareness in this question a different way. I still acted on my spatial needs in my last relationship, I just let me partner know about my issues beforehand. I was still avoidant, but he was aware and he accepted my needs. I think if I tried to suppress my needs in a relationship, I think I would just end up unhappy and frustrated. |
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Post by alpenglow on Feb 16, 2018 13:45:20 GMT
Right, I understand what you meant now.
I also think it's important to talk about such issues beforehand. Sure, it might kill some of the romantic attraction, but it's better to know in advance rather than facing difficult situations further down the line.
This is exactly what my date from yesterday did, by presenting her issues. This also gave me the opportunity to present mine, along with the needs.
Suppressing our needs is often a recipe for disaster. On the other hand, we need to rembember than some of our needs cannot be realistically met. An AP for example wants a lot more attention, validation, physical proximity etc than most people would be able to provide. So we also need to deal with that somehow. And compromise a bit?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2018 14:31:34 GMT
Right, I understand what you meant now. I also think it's important to talk about such issues beforehand. Sure, it might kill some of the romantic attraction, but it's better to know in advance rather than facing difficult situations further down the line. This is exactly what my date from yesterday did, by presenting her issues. This also gave me the opportunity to present mine, along with the needs. Suppressing our needs is often a recipe for disaster. On the other hand, we need to rembember than some of our needs cannot be realistically met. An AP for example wants a lot more attention, validation, physical proximity etc than most people would be able to provide. So we also need to deal with that somehow. And compromise a bit? If the needs are realistic, I think they can be respected on both sides through communication. There's a difference between disappearing for days and telling the other person, hey, I need 2 days to myself, do you mind? Or wanting more quality time with the other and not telling them but acting out in ways to "hint" to them that you want more time. Personally, I think the need for space and time is too strong for either party to suppress and be happy. If it can be communicated and respected on both sides, then the possibility is there. I also don't think that attachment style is a way to pick a partner as people are so varied and the spectrum is so big. Just because a person is secure doesn't mean they won't have other issues that will be deal breakers for you. Get to know the person, then make the judgement. |
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Post by alpenglow on Feb 16, 2018 15:06:07 GMT
The important adjective here is "realistic", right. I like how you present the way to ask for needs to be fulfilled. A realistic and gentle request, instead of hinting or just disappearing. I agree that the need for space and time is too important to be suppressed, so both parties do need to meet somewhere. Perhaps not every time, but enough to make the relationship work and feel respected.
As for using attachment style to pick a partner, I have a slightly different view. I find it very important to rule out people because of huge incompatibilities combination of insecure types (did you read my thread in the FA section?), while agreeing that the secure spectrum is quite large and that even secure people can be issues that will be deal breakers.
Or maybe it's about knowing what we can put up with. As an AP, I couldn't put up with someone who is not consistently there for me. So I need that kind of filter.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2018 15:27:07 GMT
The important adjective here is "realistic", right. I like how you present the way to ask for needs to be fulfilled. A realistic and gentle request, instead of hinting or just disappearing. I agree that the need for space and time is too important to be suppressed, so both parties do need to meet somewhere. Perhaps not every time, but enough to make the relationship work and feel respected. As for using attachment style to pick a partner, I have a slightly different view. I find it very important to rule out people because of huge incompatibilities combination of insecure types (did you read my thread in the FA section?), while agreeing that the secure spectrum is quite large and that even secure people can be issues that will be deal breakers. Or maybe it's about knowing what we can put up with. As an AP, I couldn't put up with someone who is not consistently there for me. So I need that kind of filter. Correct, the operative word is realistic. If you know your needs are unrealistic, that is something you will have to work out on your own. Pinpointing what your own needs are is very,very important. I agree, there will be people that you know won't be able to fit your needs and vice versa and you may know that about some people in a short time. It will take more time with some others. I want to caution about making snap judgments either way. I think a big problem with insecures in general is making snap judgements with too little information (avoidant rejects too quickly, APs accept too quickly). |
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Post by alpenglow on Feb 16, 2018 15:41:10 GMT
I agree with you. Insecures in general make snap judgement with too little information. I'm trying to change that, but you can see in the other thread how this is driving me crazy. I tend to go in the other (avoidant) direction now, rejecting too quickly instead of accepting too quickly. But it's like you say, it's about the people that you know you won't be able to fit your needs and vice versa. It feels like I already have enough information regarding the dating situation I'm refering to, but of course there is no way to be sure....
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Post by BreakingTheSpell on Feb 16, 2018 15:57:29 GMT
If the needs are realistic, I think they can be respected on both sides through communication. There's a difference between disappearing for days and telling the other person, hey, I need 2 days to myself, do you mind? Or wanting more quality time with the other and not telling them but acting out in ways to "hint" to them that you want more time. Personally, I think the need for space and time is too strong for either party to suppress and be happy. If it can be communicated and respected on both sides, then the possibility is there. I also don't think that attachment style is a way to pick a partner as people are so varied and the spectrum is so big. Just because a person is secure doesn't mean they won't have other issues that will be deal breakers for you. Get to know the person, then make the judgement. I couldnt agree more. Communication makes the difference. I acted completely different on a similar disappearance act, due to the way they were stated: 1) "We need to take some time off to think if this is going to work". I contacted him after a week, after two weeks, after 3 weeks, the time was never enough... somehow he decided to reply to my 3rd attempt and I was already in such overdrive that ALL my boundaries got erased. I gave in to everything not to have this uncertainty period anymore. 2) "lets take 3 weeks off and see if we really miss each other". I respected the no contact period to the d. After 3 weeks sharp, I contacted him, true to my style. He still needed more time to miss me but that is not the point. I responded differently, I respected the eternal 3 weeks because he wasnt vague in his request. Communication is the key. About attachment styles: A secure person doesnt necessarily mean a good catch, that is for sure. But an attachment style completely opposite to yours is def. a countdown to sorrow. I dont think you need to go on knowing somebody when it is already very clear that you have different concepts of intimacy, closeness and emotional regulation. |
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Post by yasmin on Feb 16, 2018 16:07:52 GMT
Great points. It's a subject I'm going to think a lot about.
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Post by leavethelighton on Mar 2, 2018 1:21:59 GMT
I think that awareness makes a big difference. I'm in a 15-year relationship, and before I studied attachment styles I did a lot more blame-- thinking we're a bad match, or maybe she isn't the one, or it's an inherently flawed relationship, etc., and now I'm more aware when I'm engaging in distancing strategies and when the problem is the dynamic and not the person I'm with or the relationship per se.
In a way it's made me more committed because I can see our dynamic as something we can work on-- the relationship seems less stuck in a rut, more as something that can grow and evolve over time.
Another thing it's helped me realize is that in the past when I may have just shut down in a conversation or changed the subject instead of asking someone the vulnerable question I want to ask, I can now NOT shut down in those moments. I still do sometimes, but I'm more consciously aware that it's what I'm doing and that I *could* make a different communication choice.
I think if I was single, I'd also pick up way more quickly on the red flags of someone being more avoidant than I am whereas in the past maybe I would have been strongly attracted to the allure of their apparent independence. I am not sure that even if I had that awareness in the past I would have been able to resist the allure of ending up in desire for such people, but maybe being more conscious of it would have made some positive difference.
I'd write more about this, but have to go...great topic.
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