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Post by sunrisequest on Jun 23, 2022 5:29:11 GMT
Thank you both… I agree with you alexandra , there’s not much point in going back to revisit long after the fact, and I don’t think that I would want to do this at this point anyway. I have no doubt from his latest move that he’s not in a place where he could reasonably discuss anything. That moment has passed for us now. I asked if he wanted to meet and talk, he said yes, then did his post which was really him saying ‘no’ to the talk. I can’t force it on him. I think I’m just trying to explore the reason I never spoke up to him at the time, whether there was a people pleasing element to me doing that, or whether it was a healthy thing to just brush my hands of it and walk away. I thought I was doing the healthy thing but I can’t say with certainty. This has come up for me before as well and I’d like to be prepared for the next time. To answer your question anne12 , at the time we broke up, I didn’t know about the cheating… And it’s the way I wanted to exit the relationship… with dignity. I will try some of those exercises. I have some somatic exercises, plus tapping, meditation and journaling… plus I dance to move energy to stop it getting stuck. Anger never stays long, but I also think it’s an important emotion to listen to? I feel like it’s telling me something and I need to learn something from it… just trying to figure out exactly what that lesson is. I think it’s about the fact I didn't get to have my say. |
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Post by alexandra on Jun 23, 2022 7:28:50 GMT
It's okay to be angry after the fact that you found out he misrepresented the situation, didn't give you all the information so effectively took away your ability to make an informed decision, and disrespected you. If you don't have a very secure base in yourself, that's a lot to hit your ego. Even if you do have a secure base, you'll get mad about it, though not necessarily confront anyone.
Were there negative consequences to you getting angry or expressing emotion growing up? That would be a great reason to be conditioned not to speak up as an adult. Or to turn anger towards yourself and only yourself and not communicate it or feel it's unfair for you to communicate it, or simply want to avoid conflict (end things on a good note).
At this point, I generally just process and deal with my anger unless I feel it will be productive or constructive to share it with whoever caused it. At this point, if it's say a customer service issue but I'm never going to need to see the person again, I'll probably just forget about it (though not recommended the business). If someone close to me is causing a disagreement, then I'll put in the effort to work through it. Your situation was tricky because you weren't going to be able to work through it with him. If he was that misleading, he's not going to be a reasonable human capable of understanding your side of things in a way that is constructive. At least you know in retrospect that the dissolution of the relationship was for the best. But again, it's okay to be angry about it if you're ready to process it now!
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Post by sunrisequest on Jun 23, 2022 9:19:00 GMT
Thank you anne12, you have this amazing fountain of resources!!! alexandra, you've given me a few things to think about, thank you. I will do a bit of journalling and maybe book in with my counsellor to look at this stuff a bit more deeply. But from what you're saying, it's not a bad thing to decide to take your own anger away and process it alone when you feel like the person who hurt you doesn't have the skills to communicate about it effectively. I definitely don't avoid speaking up about how I feel... and I've developed the skills to communicate assertively when I need to. This is something I've really worked on and feel fairly happy with where I am at. I've experienced a handful of really deep hurts/ruptures in some close relationships and friendships in the last few years, and in every single one of those cases, I went to them and tried to discuss in the normal reasonable ways, and I didn't get anywhere. They weren't open to hearing how I felt and shut me down... as I'm typing this I'm actually realising that perhaps this is the wound that is being triggered for me here. The fact that they didn't want to hear how I felt... that I felt my voice was taken away, or that I am rejected for trying to say how I feel. And that wound I know has come from childhood. I suppose in the situation of someone who is important to you really hurting you and making it impossible for you to discuss it with them, do you push your feelings on them anyway, by sending a text message or a letter and forcing them to hear what I think or feel, or do I take it away and process it alone knowing that whatever I say will not achieve anything productive... I chose to do the latter, so perhaps my choice to just walk away is the healthy one after all, knowing that I always attempted the healthy discussion first and made it clear I was willing to listen/talk. Thank you for saying it's okay for me to be angry... I think I needed to hear that. It comes in waves and leaves fairly quickly, and I still feel very clear and at peace about it being the end of that relationship. But yeah, the emotions are gonna keep coming for a little while I think before I reach that total acceptance stage. |
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Post by katiekitten on Jun 23, 2022 17:59:24 GMT
“ not sure if this story will help anyone else, but I guess it's just another piece of evidence that people don't just suddenly change after showing you who they are. “
Sunrisequest, thank you your post has helped me. It sounded so much like my story, only I married the FA love bomber, then everything was taken off the table so quickly. I am AP, and 3 weeks into having left him and blocked him.
Your whole discussion has helped me see more clearly what a lousy situation it is to be in a relationship with a FA. In the end he wouldn’t come and see me at weekends (we never managed to live together because of jobs) wouldn’t answer the phone to me, and when I drove round to see where he was that last weekend, I found he had gone out without his wedding ring on. It broke me. He wouldn’t even acknowledge the existence of a wife.
So I take comfort from the familiarity of your story and how you seem so strong and healed.
Thank you.
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Post by sunrisequest on Jun 24, 2022 2:46:41 GMT
Gosh katiekitten , this sounds so painful. I hope that you're doing alright - three weeks out is no time at all, so I'm sure you're going through all sorts at the moment. I hope you are getting some support?? It's quite surreal to read your own experience written out with various little differences, but in essence it's the same cycle repeated over and over. I spent a bit of time reading back in this forum and it blew my mind a little bit. I do think that being with a healed FA could be incredible, because of the depth and sensitivity that many of them seem to have... but same as any insecure attachment style, if someone is running around with unhealed wounds, you're going to bear the brunt of that as their partner. It's so sad that your ex married you but couldn't follow through on that commitment. I still have some of the promises my ex made to me ringing in my mind... marriage, moving to the country, more kids etc etc... he also really hooked me with talk of a 'conscious' relationship, because I'm into all that stuff... he said he'd read all the books, sent me inspiring instagram messages, said he wanted to heal together... man, I thought I'd fallen on my feet!!! But I think they were the words of someone who wished that was the place he was in, rather than the place he was actually in. Easy to think you've been manipulated... but I think he was most likely manipulating himself. it's really sad that he couldn't just be who he is and let me love him. I'm not sure of your story, but perhaps it's the same with your ex, where he tried to persuade himself he could commit, he craved and wanted an intimate relationship, but the reality of it is that he doesn't have the skills to do those things, and he can't let anyone too close to him. Sending you strength as you move through a rough time. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 3:33:50 GMT
Not that it doesn't all suck, but keep in mind the way you had his insecure attachment pegged in the first few dates. It's easy to wax on about how messed up someone else is, but in reality it takes a really insecure person to keep going with the radically unstable relationship behavior of an unaware FA.
I have had some real doozies when it comes to relationships but in the end I hold myself 100% responsible for blazing past red flags because I was unhealthy. It didn't happen to me, I participated because of my own issues . That mindset isn't shame and blame the victim, it's a reality I have become very comfortable with because in time I stopped bulkshitting myself and therefore, stopped letting others bullshit me.
Insecurity most often shows miles away to anyone who isn't blinded by their own insecurity.
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Post by sunrisequest on Jun 24, 2022 4:40:36 GMT
Of course you’re right, and I feel I’ve spent a lot of time looking at my part in this and learned some pretty huge lessons. I’m happy to take responsibility for my side of things… until we broke up, I had no idea that he was FA… i didn’t know half as much about attachment than I do now, and I had never seen these dynamics play out before so it has of course been a huge learning experience. And seeing how any anxious tendencies on my behalf played into that dynamic is where I have learned about myself too.
I don’t think I ignored the red flags as much as just naively thought they were workable. I talked to him about everything that I was uncomfortable about and what I felt I needed. The fact he was taking ownership and apologising and going to therapy made it very hard for me to walk away from him, and I kept forgiving and giving more chances. I’d do that differently next time. But I don’t regret it. this is how it goes sometimes, we learn through the doing… but no, it doesn’t actually stop the fact that what he did at the end was hugely hurtful and disrespectful to me, and I really had no way of knowing that’s how it would end.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 4:58:55 GMT
Of course you’re right, and I feel I’ve spent a lot of time looking at my part in this and learned some pretty huge lessons. I’m happy to take responsibility for my side of things… until we broke up, I had no idea that he was FA… i didn’t know half as much about attachment than I do now, and I had never seen these dynamics play out before so it has of course been a huge learning experience. And seeing how any anxious tendencies on my behalf played into that dynamic is where I have learned about myself too. I don’t think I ignored the red flags as much as just naively thought they were workable. I talked to him about everything that I was uncomfortable about and what I felt I needed. The fact he was taking ownership and apologising and going to therapy made it very hard for me to walk away from him, and I kept forgiving and giving more chances. I’d do that differently next time. But I don’t regret it. this is how it goes sometimes, we learn through the doing… but no, it doesn’t actually stop the fact that what he did at the end was hugely hurtful and disrespectful to me, and I really had no way of knowing that’s how it would end. I do understand, I really do. And I think most of us would prefer to be the one who called it off. Or to not be cheated on. I've been cheated on too. The hard truth is that it really seems to take something painful like this to break the insecure spell. It is the impetus for change, for many of us. And some keep going, not hitting bottom with insecure dynamics. I still say that expecting anything but disrespectful behavior from someone who behaves disrespectfully, is a trap. Laid by oneself. Disrespectful behavior escalates over time if it's tolerated. Yes, he was in therapy and able to talk a good game, and that made it difficult to leave. But we get neck deep in this kind of stuff one inch at a time and what I mean by that is, there always seems to be a very long list of transgressed boundaries before the dam breaks and it's a shitty free for all. He, like many of our exes of any insecure type, crossed many boundaries on the way to the big one. I've learned my lesson.... consistent boundary busting, insecure behavior only goes one way and it's always up to me to recognize and prevent that. There was a time I was ignorant of it all, now I am not. It took what it took to get the wisdom, is how I look at it. The past has ceased to matter to me except for how it led to where I am now, which is a good place. Flowers grow from compost. Life comes from decay. Things break down and new things come to be. That's how I see all of it. I am very sorry that you endured this, and I've been through some real crap too. Looking back, none of it surprises me... he showed me who he was in the beginning and I made excuses for it. That was my own sickness, my own need for a remedy that I didn't have at that time. I suffered for it, my own sickness. It's a process to get through it all but someday it won't be the fresh pain that it is now. |
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Post by sunrisequest on Jun 24, 2022 5:38:00 GMT
Well I think it’s clear to see where my ignorance was on all of this. I was inexperienced in dynamics that came anywhere close to this. My ex husband was and still is very respectful to me and I really trusted him. My previous relationships to that were also respectful and loving.
I trusted this guy too, and perhaps one of the biggest lessons I’ve learned is not to open my heart and give such blind trust before it’s been earned. And that actions must match words. And that my boundaries need to be more strongly enforced. I got a tattoo to remind me of these concepts a few weeks ago, so while perhaps I am not giving the impression of being someone who is looking at their own shit, I am trying my hardest.
Yeah, it’s hard to walk away from someone who says they want to heal, says all the right things and is offering you everything you thought you ever wanted. I believe he wanted to be that person, but he just couldn’t. And I wanted to believe what he was saying, so I hung in there until it self combusted.
Having spent so much time working on myself, and perhaps stupidly considering myself as fairly secure… there is a definite feeling of shame that I found myself in a relationship like this. All I can do is try and be gentle with myself, heal and move on as a better person. I’m nearly there.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 12:57:38 GMT
Well I think it’s clear to see where my ignorance was on all of this. I was inexperienced in dynamics that came anywhere close to this. My ex husband was and still is very respectful to me and I really trusted him. My previous relationships to that were also respectful and loving. I trusted this guy too, and perhaps one of the biggest lessons I’ve learned is not to open my heart and give such blind trust before it’s been earned. And that actions must match words. And that my boundaries need to be more strongly enforced. I got a tattoo to remind me of these concepts a few weeks ago, so while perhaps I am not giving the impression of being someone who is looking at their own shit, I am trying my hardest. Yeah, it’s hard to walk away from someone who says they want to heal, says all the right things and is offering you everything you thought you ever wanted. I believe he wanted to be that person, but he just couldn’t. And I wanted to believe what he was saying, so I hung in there until it self combusted. Having spent so much time working on myself, and perhaps stupidly considering myself as fairly secure… there is a definite feeling of shame that I found myself in a relationship like this. All I can do is try and be gentle with myself, heal and move on as a better person. I’m nearly there. Its the shame that needs your loving attention. These relationships or "relationshits" that we get ourselves into trigger our shame, and we would do anything we can to avoid the shame and make it right. We shove our shameful selves down and pack in a bunch of stuff all around to hide it and keep it on the down low but it drives so much of what we do when we are in a situation that devalues us. We devalue our selves. Over time this will trigger the anger you feel. Even more than what someone else might do to us, its what we do to ourselves that can light an internal rage. Thats dangerous, because once you spend your anger on someone else it can turn toward the self. Its the shame and anger that needs your support, at least as I see it. But more than anything directed outward, look to see what's directed inward. Its possible to bring all the compassion you had for him, straight home to yourself. There are great resources for dealing with shame that you may be aware of. Seeing it for what it is, bringing it out to talk about, receive empathy for, and transform is powerful. Of course your anger about what he did has a place, and the very fact that you feel it means you are fighting for you, you want to stand up for yourself and thats healthy and empowering! Your self protective aspects of yourself are coming forward. But dont let that shame get buried... thats what it does it hides and pulls you down. So make sure you're finding all the help and support you need to heal it, too. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 13:06:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 13:29:23 GMT
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Post by sunrisequest on Jun 24, 2022 15:20:21 GMT
Hmmm honestly, I’ve probably misused the word. Maybe it would be better described as embarrassment, bewilderment, disappointment that having done so much work and feeling that I had so much awareness around what I wanted, that I still found myself in an unworkable situation. I don’t feel hard on myself about it though.. I don’t feel unworthy or unloveable or like I’m somehow flawed. I really do try and give myself grace just as I give it to others.
I think all I wanted to say is that I’m committed to looking after my own side of the fence. I’ve used this forum as a way to process a few things… including some feelings of anger this week. I’m sure I’ve still got a lot to learn, but in the spirit of being gentle with myself, I think what I need at the moment is some gentle support from my friends, and a few more weeks to allow this final chapter to settle.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 15:33:36 GMT
Hmmm honestly, I’ve probably misused the word. Maybe it would be better described as embarrassment, bewilderment, disappointment that having done so much work and feeling that I had so much awareness around what I wanted, that I still found myself in an unworkable situation. I don’t feel hard on myself about it though.. I don’t feel unworthy or unloveable or like I’m somehow flawed. I really do try and give myself grace just as I give it to others. I think all I wanted to say is that I’m committed to looking after my own side of the fence. I’ve used this forum as a way to process a few things… including some feelings of anger this week. I’m sure I’ve still got a lot to learn, but in the spirit of being gentle with myself, I think what I need at the moment is some gentle support from my friends, and a few more weeks to allow this final chapter to settle. Nothing like the support of close friends who know you best. 🧡 |
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