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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2021 5:43:47 GMT
@introvert , yes, absolutely! This is why I'd told krolle earlier that what happened around the time she stood him up wasn't his fault. Yes, I'm sure there were dynamics coming from both sides playing into things throughout. There was probably some FA triggering and bumbling through things at times. But he did absolutely nothing to deserve this level of disrespect in how she's handled things, nor to be shut down without even a phone call. That's all about her and her issues. FWIW, in situations like this... I'd have to force the in person conversation which was when the break up would be blind side delivered. Then if I wanted to talk about anything, or even just get my stuff back!, it would take 3 or 4 weeks to accomplish direct contact. Not me trying consistently, just an email maybe once a week saying, when are you available to return my things? I still want them back. Eventually, I think out of a sense of shame from the guy about how I was treated and didn't deserve it, he'd fiiiiinally call instead of email/text and make plans to meet up. It seemed to be a combination of needing to come out of the avoidant deactivation shell (not even necessarily realizing how much time I was left hanging, losing track of time) and not wanting to hurt me so simply shutting down to avoid the entire situation so they felt safer. But it certainly didn't make me feel better!! Being direct would have been best for me. It was far less terrible once I stopped being hung up on what they might be doing and why because I was accepting that it reflected their issues more than anything I did, so fully understanding their behavior and justifications wasn't even necessary. But I did always opt for talking when I got the chance to do so. As I analyzed all sides of what was going on, I was able to recognize finally what cycles looked like and start choosing not to get roped into them, instead of seeing them as hope for change in the other person. And I completely agree this isn't his fault- I truly thought the opportunity to represent himself and have his say might help him get closure so to speak, at least a facet of it as I know it's complicated. I thought it would help to say the things left unsaid. But this refusing calls nonsense is just too much to entertain, at least for me. I mean I would text back a thought or two, block, and shudder 🤮 |
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Post by krolle on Nov 5, 2021 6:14:49 GMT
I messaged a few of you privately the actual content and my potential response.
Feel free to respond on here...or privately. I don't mind it being discussed here. I'm enjoying the discussion you guys are having to see the different perspectives.
Of course try keep any direct quotes from her or my message private in case of prying eyes...now or in the future.
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Post by krolle on Nov 5, 2021 6:33:29 GMT
Also to add to what I said in the PM's and has been discussed on here about me feeling angry at receiving it, I think the main purpose is to avoid guilt because I get the feeling the message was sent for 'her' own benefit. Not really to have any genuine well wishes toward me.
Especially considering the fact that we were were going great together before the sudden recent mood flip and then ghosting. Which has been addressed in no way shape or form despite me asking a bunch of times in recent weeks where were at. Like it feels patronizing or something from my end.
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Post by krolle on Nov 5, 2021 8:55:41 GMT
Another thought. Maybe she text me that message with a tone of finality to reject me before she feels rejected. After I NC for week. (given up)
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2021 13:13:40 GMT
Another thought. Maybe she text me that message with a tone of finality to reject me before she feels rejected. After I NC for week. (given up) I think this is more likely. |
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Post by krolle on Nov 5, 2021 14:20:30 GMT
Really interesting to see the different responses from you ladies in private.
Each one is very individual and quiet different. With flavours of your own personalities colouring the advice and interpretation. It's quiet nice to read....
Though I still have to decide what I'm going to do. Didn't sleep much last night. Which is ridiculous because whatever I say isn't likely to get a response anyway. I think I need to feel like I made "a good decision" for me. Not really as a futile attempt at winning anything back. Which seems forlorn at this point.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2021 14:29:20 GMT
Really interesting to see the different responses from you ladies in private. Each one is very individual and quiet different. With flavours of your own personalities colouring the advice and interpretation. It's quiet nice to read.... Though I still have to decide what I'm going to do. Didn't sleep much last night. Which is ridiculous because whatever I say isn't likely to get a response anyway. I think I need to feel like I made "a good decision" for me. Not really as a futile attempt at winning anything back. Which seems forlorn at this point. I know we are all united in our desire to see you represent yourself in the most authentic and empowered way!! I understand that forlorn feeling, and I'm sending you virtual hugs along with the others you have received. |
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Post by krolle on Nov 5, 2021 16:15:31 GMT
Hmmm empowered. It sounds good. I guess maybe if I was to be authentic right now it would be angry at being treat like crap.
Maybe I should just express my anger to her and not really give a fu*k about if she responds. Iv been holding back on the anger knowing it would shut her down. But its not like she's coming back now anyway lol.
Might just rage lol.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2021 18:06:13 GMT
Hmmm empowered. It sounds good. I guess maybe if I was to be authentic right now it would be angry at being treat like crap. Maybe I should just express my anger to her and not really give a fu*k about if she responds. Iv been holding back on the anger knowing it would shut her down. But its not like she's coming back now anyway lol. Might just rage lol. I happen to believe that anger expressed in an authentic and healthy way can be a very powerful liberator! Anger has a purpose, it's here to help us to protect ourselves. Sometimes, it can help teach people how to treat you too. |
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Post by krolle on Nov 6, 2021 15:12:33 GMT
I haven't done anything yet.
Stuck in a state of paralysis or freeze.
Wrote a million possible responses. And ruminated heavily. I'm looking for certainty where there is none.
It's quiet possible I won't respond due to being too scared to "do something wrong" and regret it. I don't know whether thats a good thing or not.
It's taking an enormous amount of energy just 'being' at the moment. Plus not sleeping well of course. concentrating at work is next to impossible.
I'm really angry still. I'm angry at her gaslighting me and stringing me along. That whilst she does everything she can to dodge guilt I feel like the worry and blame fell on me. I hate how she said made her feel unwanted, because I feel like I really tried this time. But I know any attempt from me to communicate my anger will fall on deaf ears. I feel like I just want to tell her I know your game! kinda thing.
There's a strong desire for me to call attention to behaviour I feel hurt me. Not necessarily the break up. But the breadcrumbing, gaslighting, mixed signals, drawing this out for weeks..... I don't like the idea of letting her go guilt free. That's probably very immature of me. And I know it's very unlikely she intentionally hurt me. Just acted very mindlessly and neglectful.
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 6, 2021 16:04:23 GMT
I haven't done anything yet. Stuck in a state of paralysis or freeze. Wrote a million possible responses. And ruminated heavily. I'm looking for certainty where there is none. It's quiet possible I won't respond due to being too scared to "do something wrong" and regret it. I don't know whether thats a good thing or not. It's taking an enormous amount of energy just 'being' at the moment. Plus not sleeping well of course. concentrating at work is next to impossible. I'm really angry still. I'm angry at her gaslighting me and stringing me along. That whilst she does everything she can to dodge guilt I feel like the worry and blame fell on me. I hate how she said made her feel unwanted, because I feel like I really tried this time. But I know any attempt from me to communicate my anger will fall on deaf ears. I feel like I just want to tell her I know your game! kinda thing. There's a strong desire for me to call attention to behaviour I feel hurt me. Not necessarily the break up. But the breadcrumbing, gaslighting, mixed signals, drawing this out for weeks..... I don't like the idea of letting her go guilt free. That's probably very immature of me. And I know it's very unlikely she intentionally hurt me. Just acted very mindlessly and neglectful. So I agree with what you wrote above. And I wonder if you can tie these mindless and neglectful behaviors to anyone else from your past…friends, siblings, parents. I think you are on to something very important which is that “intent” may not have been there but there was a lack of “respect”. A lack of considering you. And you have a right to be angry for that. I think it truly is kind to yourself to consider whether you will actually get the outcome you seek by responding or whether it will simply lead you down another rabbit hole. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2021 20:00:02 GMT
I haven't done anything yet. Stuck in a state of paralysis or freeze. Wrote a million possible responses. And ruminated heavily. I'm looking for certainty where there is none. It's quiet possible I won't respond due to being too scared to "do something wrong" and regret it. I don't know whether thats a good thing or not. It's taking an enormous amount of energy just 'being' at the moment. Plus not sleeping well of course. concentrating at work is next to impossible. I'm really angry still. I'm angry at her gaslighting me and stringing me along. That whilst she does everything she can to dodge guilt I feel like the worry and blame fell on me. I hate how she said made her feel unwanted, because I feel like I really tried this time. But I know any attempt from me to communicate my anger will fall on deaf ears. I feel like I just want to tell her I know your game! kinda thing. There's a strong desire for me to call attention to behaviour I feel hurt me. Not necessarily the break up. But the breadcrumbing, gaslighting, mixed signals, drawing this out for weeks..... I don't like the idea of letting her go guilt free. That's probably very immature of me. And I know it's very unlikely she intentionally hurt me. Just acted very mindlessly and neglectful. I think it's really good to be aware of what you're feeling, like this. Something that was true for me, which may or may not be your experience, is that I was able to allow all these things to be there at once, and I could deal with them individually as I chose. So all this could be true at one time: I'm angry at the things you did and said, and the impact that it had on me. ( I want to express that to you.) I see you as ugly, and that you meant harm to me! (I will not hurt you with that, it's my own pain and defense .) I see me as ugly too. (This hurts and I need to unpack and get support for it). I can see you as perhaps flawed but not malicious, You're not ugly. (I will remind myself of this and can express that to you if appropriate). I can also see myself as flawed but not malicious. (I can find grace for both of ours but I want to figure out a way to prevent this kind of damage from happening again.) This reminds me of all the times I ever felt this way and I feel enraged!!! (I will express strong anger and hurt, process and find resolution with a safe, appropriate support system, it's not yours to bear.) And other such things.... it doesn't have to be one way or the other, I don't have to make people pay for my original wound but I can create accountability in myself and in my relationships for what is happening NOW, between adults. I don't know, maybe this can help you sort out what you would like to say, if anything, and what you would like to work through on a deeper level with safe people, and good boundaries. How are you doing? |
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Post by alexandra on Nov 6, 2021 20:30:46 GMT
krolle, two questions I have after reading your post that may help you with your introspection. 1. What would create feelings of regret if you sent something? You're unlikely to get the response from her you want no matter what you say (in part as your own attachment issues are layered over the pain that's directly from her, so it's not only about her and she can't take away the other layers of pain she didn't cause) so what's to regret? There's no wrong decision here. 2. You've been on her side of this. What impact would hearing back from the woman might have made you feel? How might you have responded? Especially from an unaware mindset?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2021 20:54:19 GMT
The anger threads that anne has posted are also good sources of info/guidance.
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Post by krolle on Nov 7, 2021 15:01:36 GMT
I haven't done anything yet. Stuck in a state of paralysis or freeze. Wrote a million possible responses. And ruminated heavily. I'm looking for certainty where there is none. It's quiet possible I won't respond due to being too scared to "do something wrong" and regret it. I don't know whether thats a good thing or not. It's taking an enormous amount of energy just 'being' at the moment. Plus not sleeping well of course. concentrating at work is next to impossible. I'm really angry still. I'm angry at her gaslighting me and stringing me along. That whilst she does everything she can to dodge guilt I feel like the worry and blame fell on me. I hate how she said made her feel unwanted, because I feel like I really tried this time. But I know any attempt from me to communicate my anger will fall on deaf ears. I feel like I just want to tell her I know your game! kinda thing. There's a strong desire for me to call attention to behaviour I feel hurt me. Not necessarily the break up. But the breadcrumbing, gaslighting, mixed signals, drawing this out for weeks..... I don't like the idea of letting her go guilt free. That's probably very immature of me. And I know it's very unlikely she intentionally hurt me. Just acted very mindlessly and neglectful. So I agree with what you wrote above. And I wonder if you can tie these mindless and neglectful behaviors to anyone else from your past…friends, siblings, parents. I think you are on to something very important which is that “intent” may not have been there but there was a lack of “respect”. A lack of considering you. And you have a right to be angry for that. I think it truly is kind to yourself to consider whether you will actually get the outcome you seek by responding or whether it will simply lead you down another rabbit hole. I have no idea what the outcome will be if I do message. It's just really hard to give up on something I really valued. Like I said earlier, this was the first time in a long time I actually looked at her even when there was a threat of commitment and still felt attracted. And felt ready to take the leap. Which is big for me, Perhaps one of my worst fears. In terms of other people then I can tie the behaviour to myself. I have done a lot of what she is doing. However I don't think I ever overtly ghosted anyone. And I think I might have been open to them trying to genuinely talk to me and understand what was going on in my head. As long as it didn't feel oppressive. Secondly my first girlfriend. Who imprinted a lot of trauma by coming and going several times over about 3 or 4 years. I was totally smitten by her so she left when she wanted some extra curricular excitement and then said I'm sorry I miss you and all that stuff when her self esteem was low. And so never realised I was being used so just kept taking her back. |
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