Here we go again.

krolle, feeling like you're bothering someone and they'd prefer and hope you disappear, and how painful and damaging that feels, is an insecure "symptom." It may be a story in your head or it may actually be true (since she's also insecure), but the shame around it, the perception that if anything within an important relationship is unequal in any way, if you're not on the same page, that there's an imagined power disparity -- all or any of that is part of insecure conditioning and completely arbitrary. I'm pointing this out because as AP, nothing felt worse than not being on the same page as whatever attachment figure. But I could not EXPLAIN how this made any sense once I started becoming aware of it. I still can't really explain how it did, but it was a strong feeling. It's not one I feel anymore because working out the other aspects of insecure attachment naturally addressed it. But it's one of those things you should introspect about where it might be really coming from, because at least in my experience it was helpful for me to ask why I felt this way and conclude I had no answer. It takes some power away from the feeling to label it and then to acknowledge that it doesn't actually make sense, so what else might it be telling you about some unrelated disconnection from self? Which may eventually lead to further processing.

Choosing not to rebound-hook up with others is fine. It's a way to avoid processing and layer on distractions on top of what you're dealing with so you never have to deal with any of it. Until you do, all at once, with more and more layers. You can also hook up if you want, since it sounds like you're being respectful and honest to others about not jumping into a new relationship right now, and that's fine as well. But I agree that being aware that it is your decision to make and own and part of your process and how you're feeling is the most important part.

Personally, I had such a gross and messy hookup a few hours after a devastating dumping several years ago (it wasn't a random person, but he turned out to be so messy I didn't end up sleeping with him) that I finally recognized I didn't actually understand the saying "the best way to get over someone is to get under someone else" and never had. It was a cultural mantra others seemed to abide by so being AP I always assumed they were right and I was wrong and there must be something to it. Especially in this specific situation, I felt way worse instead, now had an extra layer of complete visceral discomfort to deal with on top of the heartrending breakup (yep, another blind side breakup by an FA ex who was prior to the one I usually write about). And I'd never really felt better after past rebound hook ups anyway when I stopped to think about it. They were just fleeting attempts to soothe a temporarily collapsed ego. So I actually took the time to ask myself for the first time... wtf am I doing? And I learned they weren't for me. Having a choice of trying something out and it not working, learning that, and finally taking more ownership over my actions made my life better longer-term, even if I still was distraught over that breakup. But I wasn't ready to process it that way prior to that time, until that experience and all the AP/avoidant devastating breakups and repeated patterns to get there.

I'm curious, what kind of answers do you mean? Of course, it's better to ask questions rather than mind read, I agree. But I often find that when a person's behaviors are gross their "answers" tend to be gross too.
At any rate, I think it's a very personal and individual choice whether or not to engage the person that broke up with them. Debriefing is helpful to some, not helpful to others. It all depends on where they are at with it.

Yeah, I get it. Getting a gross answer sure can knock a person off their pedestal. For me, it's typically been about "What the hell was I thinking here?" rather than "What the hell are they thinking?" Someone's real answers show in their behaviors. What more can be said? Even someone's intentions don't matter in the end, unless one is trying to get validation from an ex. That's DICEY.

My experience is trying to debrief with someone who jerks you around results in more jerking around.

I get that though- it took what it took for me to drop the narc. I couldn't believe someone could be as selfish as he so I literally was in denial, thought I was missing something. What I was missing was my self respect lol! It takes what it takes and if the end result is more wisdom and advancement along the path to secure then it's not all a waste.

I still don't know why you assume she met someone else. Many of us who have dated FAs have had the flip and it had nothing to do with meeting someone else. It had to do with a change in energy, their sensitivity to us being as strong as ours to them. Meaning, when the stakes are being raised because they can sense intimacy or a desire for commitment increasing on our end (even if we haven't gotten around to saying it yet), that in itself can be enough to disconnect and shut down and be done. In some of my cases, it was because they'd hoped certain feelings would develop that didn't (basically hoping to get triggered anxious, but not being cognizant that it was attachment-related), and they started feeling really guilty that I seemed more attached than they could reciprocate. They didn't want to feel responsible for me falling in love when they knew they couldn't show up for that. One told me that a few months later, but he also told me lots of things that kept flipping over time. While I'm sure in some of these situations the exes began casually dating others immediately, whether rebounding or celebrating newfound "freedom," I'm also sure the seemingly 180 degree blindsiding breakups had little to nothing to do with anyone else.

What would I ask annieb? And how would you word it?

I agree with you a shut down can come because of the fear of commitment and not necessarily because there is another specific person lined up.

But what is a fear of commitment for someone searching for external validation and novelty?
Worded alternatively it's that the fear that our commitment to you means we can't get guilt free extra curricular sexual activity/validation/ opportunity from new and interesting partners to feel good about ourselves. My problems with commitment are rarely because I don't enjoy your company or still want to be with you in some incarnation, they are because of FOMO on other opportunities.

Having said that, on this particular occasion there were just a lot of clues that suggested she met someone else whilst we were still spending time together. Or several other people. For a start, she started the contraceptive pill after she put the sex shut down on me. I can't really see any reason why you would start that unless you were looking to have unprotected sex at some point in the near future.

Also, I missed a lot of red flags I'm really disappointed in myself for doing so. For example, when we first started hanging out she was trying to get rid of someone she had been recently seeing who she described as really clingy. At the time I was of course dealing with the borderline stuff from my ex so I just talked to her about boundaries and stuff, and that this person might be very anxious or personality disordered. But in hind sight I realize that she gave me her number and started spending time with me romantically while she was still involved with this person. And she seemed to very quickly forget about them when we became intimate. I now feel empathy for this person who was mostly likely love bombed and then discarded just as I have been. I also was able to put 2 and 2 together about her geographical history of constantly running from ex partners, which is almost as extensive as mine.

As the ice out began she also started telling me more incongruities and gaslighting, and when I asked her to spend time together or to talk she often described being unavailable due to being on weekend trips with her family or friends.......But her relationship to her family was very strained and spending significant time with them before was almost unheard of. I'm very skeptical.

She would tell me that she didn't have much of a sexual appetite, but then call me at 11pm to go over and sleep with her.

I think the whole situationship was probably a rebound or monkey branch for her. And I feel stupid for letting myself catch feelings. I don't even know if the person I got to know and like existed, or if it was all just a facade.

I have had plenty of hook ups before or even situationships where it just fizzled out and neither of us was really that hurt by it. But this ones stings because I really felt roped in and coerced out of my defence mechanisms to form a bond. I fought it for several months and then when I finally gave in and let myself feel this warm feeling in my chest of wanting to be with her, the shutdown began, she was the one that suggested being exclusive, and that she wanted more communication, and for us to go to her family party as a couple. At any point prior to that I think I would have just been a little disappointed.


Anyway....I'm just venting.....I'm not in quiet the state I was at the start of this thread. But still hurting quiet a bit.