Here we go again.

I had horrible periods and was assigned a birth control pill in order to reduce cramping and have a regular cycle.  This occurred waaay before I dated anyone.

I understand, and you are correct about getting a sense of someone's dating history. I guess I was just really infatuated with her and it allowed me to ignore it. I'd like to think I should have known better after all the effort I have put into this stuff the past year or 2. Some people's subconsious' can be very devious in roping you in. Emphasis on subconscious, as I know she likely couldn't help treating me this way.....She's basically me 5 years ago.

I remembered knowing that I should pay attention to someone's relationship history when meeting her. It's the kind of stuff we were talking about on this forum in real time, as I met her and was getting to know her. Its hard for me to reconcile why I could not process or implement that information consciously. I think I was really attracted to her and my brain wanted so badly for her affections toward me to be real. It altered my reality to ignore certain things and be selective about my attention. 

Regarding the contraception, it wasn't for health reasons. It was to explore her options sexually. She communicated this to me, if indirectly. I guess it was just too painful to process.

I also think I was/am guilty of falling for potential. Which we have discussed on here before as being a tempting, but untenable position. I knew she had problems, but she kept saying things like "what's wrong with me?, or (in response to a weird attachment behaviour) "I think I know why I do this, but its hard to explain" etc. And she would be deep in thought. Part of my brain was like excited she is on the cusp of discovery like I was recently. And it felt a kindred spirit in that to connect with. You have suggested this to me before alexandra and I believe it was an astute reasoning.

I fear being replaced because it has happened to me on several occasions before and is always exquisitely painful. Partly for the reasons it is for anybody. And partly because of my own fears that I am not desirable genetically, not good enough,etc (insert generic feeling unwanted/ undesirable core wound). I seek validation for proof I am desirable/ good enough so when I get a stark emotional reminder to the contrary, it cuts deep....... And yes.......Before anybody says it...I know, I know....self fulfilling prophecy..........sigh

A particularly painful replacement I believe have discussed on the forum before, I was given an STD, ghosted, and then told by mutual friends that I had been replaced within a week. And the same friends told me that while we were dating she was having unprotected sex with other guys sometimes as little as hours before we slept together. I remember feeling absolutely worthless and disgusted. 

I will try challenge my assumptions, I know its easy to project past pain points onto current situations, but I really do think that I was replaced because the patterns are just too familiar. My subconscious knew long before I did it was an unhealthy situation. 

I believe I described it on the thread already, or maybe it was a conversation with a friend. I cant remember. But I had a vivid dream about a storm coming just before the flip happened. ....SUbconsious are weird powerful entities.....

I think he is scared of me. I walk around that place like I own it.

I would think that would make him want to hide/lie more?!

This will be long because I was trying to structure it simply but the whole thing is still a learning process and I think the answers of what to do next (in regards to ask / don't ask) can be different for secures and for insecures trying to get to secure. Meaning that even if an insecure doesn't act fully secure while struggling to figure this out and has trouble with the concept of "closure comes from self" and still wants answers, that's okay. Because there's more to learn and understand to get to a secure perspective of emotional processing, and that may involve additional steps and experiences.

First, my experience as insecure dating / getting dumped by (avoidant) insecure.

I've been able to get real answers if I wait and the person isn't triggered on the defensive. But it has to be when they sincerely believe I won't "punish" them or won't approach a conversation either obviously emotional or seeking to reconcile. The problem is still that they may be unknowingly lying to themselves so then they can't be fully honest, authentic, or vulnerable with you even if they believe in the moment that they are.

The best answers I've gotten, in regards to being helpful to understand attachment styles and my interaction with people of other styles, were slowly trickled out over time and sometimes contradictory if the person was triggered anxious or avoidant, so it depended on what their needs and mindset was at the time.

There's always been aspects of truth to all answers I've received, but they still needed to be taken with a grain of salt and pasted together over time because of the lack of self-awareness of the person answering. Prior to knowing more about what I was "looking" for in the answers (which ended up being understanding attachment styles and perspectives that differed from my own), I'd use answers more for what annieb is talking about. That if they said something hurtful, offensive, or seemingly irrational, at least I had a definitive no and could force myself to move on. Though the healthier thing as an insecure who wanted to understand while also being heard myself would have be to be revolted by the offensiveness of the answer and not want to be with someone like that because I deserve better (instead of feeling like I must have done something wrong and deserved poor treatment until I improved).

Next, since krolle asked about what's most "secure" ie is even asking someone for answers secure... in my opinion, most secure is accepting this person doesn't want to be in a relationship with me AND shifting into the perspective of, I don't want to be with someone who neither chooses me nor treats me with the respect and love I'm looking for. So being sad and mourning it, but not seeing it as a reflection of self-worth or as a betrayal that you should project on how you view new people you'll meet in the future.

I also think all people deserve answers (secures, too) and it's really not okay to stonewall someone and just leave them... but back to a secure digestion of a stonewall situation. If the other person does that and won't communicate, then it indicates the above of: they are a bad partner for me who doesn't treat me with the love and respect I'm looking for, and I recognize this isn't a reflection of me or my worth because it's a reflection of their own inability to handle interpersonal conflict. So a secure may be disappointed they didn't get the answers they deserved, but the other person's inability to provide them reflects and reinforces why they're not a good partner choice. It doesn't matter why when this is still the outcome. Then it's back to accepting the truth of why continuing to try to get answers is futile and that there's no complete connection to be forged with this person that would meet your basic needs, unless they change. And you don't want someone changing you, so it's not fair to push anything onto them either. Which then equates to accepting the reality of who the person is, without overlaying the potential. All this leads to acceptance and closure, even if you never get the answers from them that you're looking for, which is why it is said that closure eventually comes from self rather than from another person.

So, it can be secure to ask one time as long as you're not just doing it to prolong the idea of the connection, but you need to accept whatever the answers are, even if there are no answers or they're only half-truths. Expecting an insecure with their own issues to give you what you want and need is usually futile, so the closure is still going to come from yourself eventually. Which means it's then up to you if you even want to bother putting in the energy to ask.

For an insecure in process of learning (as you are), it can be a useful exercise in practicing communicating to ask to understand the breakup better because you're accepting and asserting that having your own needs and that acknowledging them is okay. Plus, it's an exercise in really listening to the other person's response. You can't expect anything from a shut down insecure ex partner, but you're aware enough to know their poor responses or disrespectful behavior is not personal. And it will help you next time with the next person, because you felt what it was like within yourself to try to improve your communication (for which effort you can and should feel self-respect!), and it gets a little easier every subsequent time. Even if it goes poorly and you're rejected or belittled, you survive if you don't abandon yourself. And then go to whatever support systems you have to b*tch about the breakup being crappy, lol.

So I didnt really say anything on the public forum until now because I didnt want to give a few of the newbies false hope. But I was actually contacted by lady #1 a few weeks ago after a couple months of no contact.

I was not expecting it after the last message she sent before. Which I showed several of you guys in DM'S, and clearly had an air of finality to it. A desire to get rid of me, for want of a better word.

The message she sent this time was very lack lustre. Typical breadcrumbing. Something along the lines of "Hows it going?". My initial reaction was somewhere between anger and excitement. Even the fact that it was such a crappy way to reach out to someone who you hurt so badly, my subconscious still felt that excitement. I hate that.

Since then we have been exchanging very surface level texts approximately once a day. I'm struggling to get into my head that her reaching out is not a good thing. So I feel like I'm trying to use my knowledge to "game" the situation or something equally crap. Hope has reintroduced itself in such a cruel and forlorn way. I consciously know this is not healthy for me, and have been told as much by a few people here on the forum. But I can't stop it. I feel like the proverbial junkie who's going through rehab and finds himself with a needle in his arm right after it. I feel melancholic. Certainly not the mess I was in the first time she ghosted me. But just numb and a bit hopeless.

A predictable pattern seems to be playing out. Probably not surprising to many of you on here.
I was understandably skittish about talking, so remained mostly unavailable and skeptical in the initial text exchanges. Short messages, only responding when I had time. Or nothing else pressing in my own schedule. But a little momentum began to build and I found myself enjoying the interaction and loosening off a little. Slightly longer texts, just barely touching on some deeper conversations. Really, me walking on eggshells to try not activate her hair trigger sense of attraction/attention. It has been both exciting and very uncomfortable. But overall a largely negative net experience, mostly dictated by anxiety.

We got to the point where I guess she realised I wasnt showing (at least outwardly) much signs of anxiety or dependance on her, and I think that gave her nervous system enough safety to ask if I wanted to meet up. But it was VERY non commital on her part.

I paraphrase to protect privacy, so dont read this quote literally....But something along the lines of

"Like, maybe, when things are a bit safer from covid we might be able to go for a drink, in the future?"

Nothing even remotely concrete. My guess is that she was subconsciously checking for my availability. I responded tentatively.... Again this is paraphrasing..

"I'm not sure how I feel about that, but agree it would be nice to see you"

was that too non commital on my part? perhaps triggering her fearing a rejection?... Or just an invite for her to view me as weak, I dont even know anymore....sigh

With grim inevitability, since then, the conversation has dropped off considerably. Almost another ghosting, but not quiet. Still occasional texts and pictures.

This time I predicted it though. My subconscious knows when its gonna happen, even before I do these days. The texts get really strange before she vanishes. Basically completely ignoring, or only vaguely referencing whatever I have said in the previous message. Followed by a series of over the top compliments to me. Like, I get a sickly sweet feeling from them. Its too much, too false. I sort of get the feeling she is trying to do it to make her feel less guilty, knowing she's about to discard me. But I'm not sure anymore.
It's all really weird behaviour from this side of things.
It's like i'm not even communicating with a human being. Just a robot, or somebody possesed. I cant work out if she's just FA or maybe something worse. I certainly feel very used at this point. There has been almost no consideration of my feelings. And no recognition of accountability or desire to talk about anything that went on, why she reached out. Or how she feels. Or how I feel. Its a massive juxtaposition of how she was when we were dating.

So, I feel like I stand on a precipice. I know everyone is likely going to just tell me to get out of this. But I dont know if I'm strong enough. I feel like I want to lay down some consequences, tell her this is not acceptable. But I also know part of me wants to do that as a protest behaviour. Hoping it will shock her into activation. Which I know is not the point. And somewhat manipulative.

I was hoping she would bring up something more substantial at some point over the last few weeks. Even just an apology would have felt good. But nothing. I think I'm just a back up at this point. To be used when she feels bad. It's hard to accept that. I must admit I feel very worthless, very disposable.

I'm writing a few potential messages that I might say to basically end our communication. But it's really hard. My abandonment wounds feel raw and exposed and I miss her a lot (well, I miss the facade she presented lets say).
I do want to adress the things that are bothering me with her, even if she doesnt respond. That was one of the things that really bothered me last time. The complete inability to communicate and denying me the chance to express myself or even make me feel as though I was anthing more than supply.

Anyhow, I know what you guys are gonna say. So I guess Im mostly writing this for my own journalling purposes. But input is welcome, as always, if anyone desires.

Hey krolle, I'm sorry you're going through the madness.
If you accomplish nothing else, maybe you can accomplish abolishing text as a means of insecure "communication",and tell her either you two speak on the phone or you don't speak at all. If she bolts, AWESOME, because ....
Text is the superhighway of miscommunication, unreal, fictional, ridiculous story-making ,imaginations run amok, games, powerplays, cop outs and disrespect... it's just literally the shittiest way for adults to "communicate", ever. And anyone who limits their interactions to text is absolutely, unequivocally, NOT emotionally capable of anything but an insecure game and YOU LOSE. So if that's what she needs, good riddance. And if that's what you need, examine why.

If neither of you can talk voice to voice then shitcan the whole thing and try to figure out :
1) why you're hiding behind a device
2) why you're relying on your imagination to fill in the blanks instead of actually interacting in a real way
3) what interests you about a woman who hides behind a phone
4) how long you're willing to do the same thing and expect different results (you've been here done that with this person).

Not at all talking tough to you, I'm friendly and just hating to see anyone hurting over this kind of insecure entanglement. It's crazymaking for you.