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Post by kristyrose on Feb 12, 2018 18:12:19 GMT
Hey everyone, I'm starting to realize a few things about my relationship with my ex FA. Most of you know my story, he broke up with me in April last year, then we started hanging out again on a routine basis for the past 9 months. I took it as dating since we were exclusive and did go on dates, spent weekends at each others places, but he saw it as being friends. During the course of this post break-up time, he would remind me were were not really together, but then still hang out with me in the same manner occasionally taking a weekend here and there to himself. I would pull away whenever he mentioned that we should not have any expectations, he would then pursue a little and I took that all as he is just in denial, he is out of touch with his feelings, he really wants to be with me- obviously! I chose to ignore his words and just viewed his actions as the definitive sign. I'm realizing now how much denial I was in. I knew the whole time deep down he did not want to get back together, but I chose to believe he would change his mind or perhaps i could shepherd him back into a real relationship with me by doing whatever he wanted and even pulling away occasionally so he would pursue. Eventually we had a talk and it all came out that we are not on the same page, I was very hurt, we stopped talking and during this time of silence I have come to the realization of how strong my denial really was. Had I faced the truth, that he only wants to be friends, then I would have walked away sooner instead of waiting to essentially be left or dumped again. I guess I'm wondering why I put myself through this, why I reenacted another breakup with him when the first one was so incredibly painful. I created the cage I lived in the past 9 months, and I'm trying to figure out and understand why. Anyone else relate? Have you read this, Kristy? www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/this-isnt-love-youre-in-pattern-theyre-in-pattern/Thank you for this! I read it this morning and it made me realize how much I keep blaming MYSELF for the problems we had and for the post break up time together. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2018 18:34:13 GMT
I also just thought of this while I was picking up my food. It may have something to do with the way you trust. When words and actions don't match, you have to decide which one to believe or which carries more weight. Some pick words over actions and others vice versa. I pick actions over words as you did. My ex, in the beginning actually told me he was an asshole! None of his actions though spoke to that. In the end though, yea, he's kind of an asshole. I have to agree with this in the way of how I trust. I tend to believe more in actions as well, but after this experience I do feel that words and actions must match up. It is such a mind F**K to deal with someone who claims they do not have feelings for you, to turn around and express actions that indicate feelings. It's painful and confusing if you choose to believe those actions, as I did. But also, his claims of not wanting to be in a relationship DID turn out to be true in the end, so it's almost like a delayed action to the words I guess. For me, it was the way that I trust as well as a deep denial. I totally get where you are coming from! I do trust actions more, but I was also in denial/avoidance of certain things he said. Total mindf**k in the end. |
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 12, 2018 18:39:01 GMT
Oh yes! the deep denial was there for me as well. I literally have to fight the denial I still feel that he doesnt have feelings for me- it's just crazy how strong denial is.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2018 18:46:17 GMT
Oh yes! the deep denial was there for me as well. I literally have to fight the denial I still feel that he doesnt have feelings for me- it's just crazy how strong denial is. I have a question, cause I am just wondering if you experience the denial differently than I do. When you were together, were you conscious of his ambivalence, but thought or hoped that he would change? Or thought that things would get better with time? For me, my denial is like it's not even there. My avoidance allows me not to even be conscious of bad treatment, until it gets to a severe point. So I am not hoping he will change, I don't even realize it's there! Just curious if it's different or similar since our styles are so different. |
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 12, 2018 19:31:00 GMT
Oh yes! the deep denial was there for me as well. I literally have to fight the denial I still feel that he doesnt have feelings for me- it's just crazy how strong denial is. I have a question, cause I am just wondering if you experience the denial differently than I do. When you were together, were you conscious of his ambivalence, but thought or hoped that he would change? Or thought that things would get better with time? For me, my denial is like it's not even there. My avoidance allows me not to even be conscious of bad treatment, until it gets to a severe point. So I am not hoping he will change, I don't even realize it's there! Just curious if it's different or similar since our styles are so different. Happy to answer, Mary! I was very conscious of his ambivalence. In fact, I was so in tune with it, when I felt him drift during our relationship, I would back off to give him space to miss me. About 6 months into dating I got Jeb's book and started paying close attention to both how I showed up and my ex. I truly believed if I kept a close eye on us and monitored MY behavior, then he would come around and start wanting to be spend more time with me, or feel more certain about me. It did not help, that his group of long term friends kept telling me how different it was with me, that he never introduced other girlfriends or spent as much time with them as he did with me. So whenever I let my ex have space, he would come back almost refreshed and more into the relationship, only to repeat the same distancing shortly after. I honestly believed in my heart, the longer we stayed together, the more he would feel safe and see the value in investing. The opposite happened and he started to find more and more flaws with me and reasons to break up, only to come back once I stopped speaking to him. This coming back, ignited a firm belief in me, that my theories were right- that he started to see the value in investing long term, but- I was wrong again! So, denial is quite strong indeed. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2018 19:51:49 GMT
the site The Love Compass has an article on “Hope Finding” that might help you too Kristyrose.
i think it’s a normal thing, just goes into overdrive with anxious attachment?
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 12, 2018 20:08:43 GMT
the site The Love Compass has an article on “Hope Finding” that might help you too Kristyrose. i think it’s a normal thing, just goes into overdrive with anxious attachment? Yes, I think it does go into overdrive with an anxious attachment style, because most of us believe if we just get it right, the person will see our value. I believed that if i showed him how i could back off, be more independent, not bring up topics he didn't like, that he would come around. It's a belief that i could control the outcome by being "good". This of course came from being raised in a home where needs were ignored in fact frowned upon as being inconvenient, so I would often keep quiet as a child in the hopes of winning over my parents. I was also physically abused by my mom, the middle kid of three, the two others were not hit. so I always thought there was something wrong with me. My ex behaved similar to my parents, he never hit me, but he would give me just enough attention/criticism to make me want to win him over. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2018 20:14:44 GMT
i’m sorry kristyrose  |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2018 20:37:06 GMT
the site The Love Compass has an article on “Hope Finding” that might help you too Kristyrose. i think it’s a normal thing, just goes into overdrive with anxious attachment? Yes, I think it does go into overdrive with an anxious attachment style, because most of us believe if we just get it right, the person will see our value. I believed that if i showed him how i could back off, be more independent, not bring up topics he didn't like, that he would come around. It's a belief that i could control the outcome by being "good". This of course came from being raised in a home where needs were ignored in fact frowned upon as being inconvenient, so I would often keep quiet as a child in the hopes of winning over my parents. I was also physically abused by my mom, the middle kid of three, the two others were not hit. so I always thought there was something wrong with me. My ex behaved similar to my parents, he never hit me, but he would give me just enough attention/criticism to make me want to win him over. It's awful, yeah, this telling ourselves that if we can control our own behaviour and [re]actions, then we can somehow "guide" them to giving us what we need from them - namely love, reassurance of our value. But even if this does work a little, it's *never* going to be consistent and this is the most toxic part of all of this deluded dance: Intermittent reinforcement. What also killed me was she told me that I was "best ever" partner to her, and I know from her friends that she has never talked about anyone like she did of me, and I was introduced to people that she had previously kept to herself. But you know what, you must remember that just because you really were the most special person they've ever been with, that's still a relative term that is ultimately meaningless, especially if your experience in the relationship is mostly miserable. Being told this appealed so much to the fixer in me, that I thought I was actually getting somewhere. But you never will get anywhere because you cannot fix them and their attention will always be haphazardly given and unpredictably withdrawn. It's a monstrous cycle of heartbreak, helplessness and misery. Be glad you're out of it. I fight every goddamn day with myself on this, and I still can't believe that for a six month relationship, I've been suffering like having the death of a parent for nearly two months now. It's... just insanity. |
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 12, 2018 21:15:11 GMT
i’m sorry kristyrose thank you Tgat |
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 12, 2018 21:49:29 GMT
Yes, I think it does go into overdrive with an anxious attachment style, because most of us believe if we just get it right, the person will see our value. I believed that if i showed him how i could back off, be more independent, not bring up topics he didn't like, that he would come around. It's a belief that i could control the outcome by being "good". This of course came from being raised in a home where needs were ignored in fact frowned upon as being inconvenient, so I would often keep quiet as a child in the hopes of winning over my parents. I was also physically abused by my mom, the middle kid of three, the two others were not hit. so I always thought there was something wrong with me. My ex behaved similar to my parents, he never hit me, but he would give me just enough attention/criticism to make me want to win him over. It's awful, yeah, this telling ourselves that if we can control our own behaviour and [re]actions, then we can somehow "guide" them to giving us what we need from them - namely love, reassurance of our value. But even if this does work a little, it's *never* going to be consistent and this is the most toxic part of all of this deluded dance: Intermittent reinforcement. What also killed me was she told me that I was "best ever" partner to her, and I know from her friends that she has never talked about anyone like she did of me, and I was introduced to people that she had previously kept to herself. But you know what, you must remember that just because you really were the most special person they've ever been with, that's still a relative term that is ultimately meaningless, especially if your experience in the relationship is mostly miserable. Being told this appealed so much to the fixer in me, that I thought I was actually getting somewhere. But you never will get anywhere because you cannot fix them and their attention will always be haphazardly given and unpredictably withdrawn. It's a monstrous cycle of heartbreak, helplessness and misery. Be glad you're out of it. I fight every goddamn day with myself on this, and I still can't believe that for a six month relationship, I've been suffering like having the death of a parent for nearly two months now. It's... just insanity. Yes indeed it is awful. I've had to take a moment to just let the tears flow today. I know the grief is mostly stemming from the deep fear of abandonment and rejection. Somewhere inside his not wanting me just confirms I am unloveable and alone. I know logically this is not true, that I have many wonderful friends and can be happy one day, the pain feels so deep, it hurts to breathe today. I am so sorry you are feeling this way too- if you can, try to understand it is not really about them, it is what we must tend to inside. I am not really out of the cycle, we have started to speak again and saw each other yesterday, but the outcome of not being together of course is the same. So I keep telling myself that no matter what, it is over- the more I think of him, see him, the more tied to the cycle I pain I keep myself in. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2018 21:59:39 GMT
I have a question, cause I am just wondering if you experience the denial differently than I do. When you were together, were you conscious of his ambivalence, but thought or hoped that he would change? Or thought that things would get better with time? For me, my denial is like it's not even there. My avoidance allows me not to even be conscious of bad treatment, until it gets to a severe point. So I am not hoping he will change, I don't even realize it's there! Just curious if it's different or similar since our styles are so different. Happy to answer, Mary! I was very conscious of his ambivalence. In fact, I was so in tune with it, when I felt him drift during our relationship, I would back off to give him space to miss me. About 6 months into dating I got Jeb's book and started paying close attention to both how I showed up and my ex. I truly believed if I kept a close eye on us and monitored MY behavior, then he would come around and start wanting to be spend more time with me, or feel more certain about me. It did not help, that his group of long term friends kept telling me how different it was with me, that he never introduced other girlfriends or spent as much time with them as he did with me. So whenever I let my ex have space, he would come back almost refreshed and more into the relationship, only to repeat the same distancing shortly after. I honestly believed in my heart, the longer we stayed together, the more he would feel safe and see the value in investing. The opposite happened and he started to find more and more flaws with me and reasons to break up, only to come back once I stopped speaking to him. This coming back, ignited a firm belief in me, that my theories were right- that he started to see the value in investing long term, but- I was wrong again! So, denial is quite strong indeed. Thank you for the answer. I see it's a different process, but largely the same result. Each relationship is a lesson learned. Kristyrose, you are doing very difficult, but important work within yourself. I hope you feel better very soon. |
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 12, 2018 22:16:27 GMT
Happy to answer, Mary! I was very conscious of his ambivalence. In fact, I was so in tune with it, when I felt him drift during our relationship, I would back off to give him space to miss me. About 6 months into dating I got Jeb's book and started paying close attention to both how I showed up and my ex. I truly believed if I kept a close eye on us and monitored MY behavior, then he would come around and start wanting to be spend more time with me, or feel more certain about me. It did not help, that his group of long term friends kept telling me how different it was with me, that he never introduced other girlfriends or spent as much time with them as he did with me. So whenever I let my ex have space, he would come back almost refreshed and more into the relationship, only to repeat the same distancing shortly after. I honestly believed in my heart, the longer we stayed together, the more he would feel safe and see the value in investing. The opposite happened and he started to find more and more flaws with me and reasons to break up, only to come back once I stopped speaking to him. This coming back, ignited a firm belief in me, that my theories were right- that he started to see the value in investing long term, but- I was wrong again! So, denial is quite strong indeed. Thank you for the answer. I see it's a different process, but largely the same result. Each relationship is a lesson learned. Kristyrose, you are doing very difficult, but important work within yourself. I hope you feel better very soon. Thank you Mary :-) It hurts, but I do know it's not all because of him, but of the deep issues I am sorting through. I just wish I knew more about what his experience was like. He refuses to talk about it only to say "we fought too much" and his feelings were not that strong. This confuses me as well, only because he came back after dumping me - I just wish I had a better understanding of his experience with me, but outcome indeed is the same. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2018 22:31:24 GMT
Thank you for the answer. I see it's a different process, but largely the same result. Each relationship is a lesson learned. Kristyrose, you are doing very difficult, but important work within yourself. I hope you feel better very soon. Thank you Mary :-) It hurts, but I do know it's not all because of him, but of the deep issues I am sorting through. I just wish I knew more about what his experience was like. He refuses to talk about it only to say "we fought too much" and his feelings were not that strong. This confuses me as well, only because he came back after dumping me - I just wish I had a better understanding of his experience with me, but outcome indeed is the same. Yeah, I got "we're not just not compatible" - which is inarguable in any pragmatic sense, but it's just irritating in the saddest way that her understanding of our incompatibilities is utterly different than mine - along with "I just don't feel the way about you that you want me to..." -- but they're just words, Kristy. He loved you in the best way he could, as did she with me. You deserve a fulfilling - and consistent - love. Stay strong. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2018 22:51:12 GMT
Thank you Mary :-) It hurts, but I do know it's not all because of him, but of the deep issues I am sorting through. I just wish I knew more about what his experience was like. He refuses to talk about it only to say "we fought too much" and his feelings were not that strong. This confuses me as well, only because he came back after dumping me - I just wish I had a better understanding of his experience with me, but outcome indeed is the same. I think there is a lot of confusion about people "coming back" from what I see posted on this site. I think it is quite rare that people that break up and make up actually end up together, because one person always feels stronger than the other. I think this is somewhat common no matter the style. I think the discrepancy is much larger in AP/avoidant pairings. I don't see that trying again at a failed relationship necessarily means the person has strong feelings still, but they have some feelings and are willing to see where it goes. In your case, I think your ex handled the situation very poorly and caused a whole lot more confusion and hurt. |
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